It's a Sh!t storm for sure.
Ancient ethnic and cultural rivalries again negate sense and peace.
These documentaries are worth watching if you haven't already seen them.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TNKsLlK52ss
http://youtu.be/TNKsLlK52ss
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y57vy4vWb-E
http://youtu.be/Y57vy4vWb-E
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QnpXASPd1h4
http://youtu.be/QnpXASPd1h4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UGSrcYLsOMI
http://youtu.be/UGSrcYLsOMI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pFlLN9E2kcY
http://youtu.be/pFlLN9E2kcY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EdBeGwXgoqI
http://youtu.be/EdBeGwXgoqI
More to come.
the simple fact that these soldiers are not wearing any insignia speaks volumes here.
A cursory glance at their hardware and of course vehicle licence plates (belive it or not) tells you they are most definitely Russian troops.
The Kremlin vehemently denies this.
so blatant a lie at this point seems ridiculous and disturbing.
In a nutshell what that means is they have a cart blanche to act with no redress.
It's not just about plausible deniability – everyone knows these guys are Russian soldiers. I worry about what the ulterior motive is. Possibly the Russians think this will give them license to commit crimes, including war crimes. License to incite violence, which they then can use as a justification for a full invasion and annexation of Ukraine. I'm not sure. But clearly, Russian troops are acting like, and looking like, thugs. And the masks give them immunity from prosecution on a personal, and national level. It's all pretty scary.
One thing I don't understand is why are the Ukrainian soldiers inside the military bases unarmed, as I have read and seen more than once reports of those soldiers not being able to defend themselves because of that.
At first they were ordered to keep all weapons locked up to avoid any potential flare ups.
It would have been futile anyway as they are heavily out gunned.
One reporter said she could see a paratrooper tattoo on various " Russian" soldiers hands. So they are heavily out classed also.
Ukraine maps chart Crimea's troubled past
If Crimea were to join Russia after the planned referendum on 17 March, it would be the latest of many changes to the map of Ukraine during the country's troubled past.
Passions are being fired by history, as the old maps in the British Library's collection reveal.
Crimea, a small peninsula in the Black Sea, below Russia and Ukraine, is now the focus and flashpoint of the crisis, threatening to loosen ties with Kiev or even return to Russian rule.
In the 18th Century, it was part of the Turkish Ottoman Empire, ruled by the Khan of the Crimean Tatars
(http://i1284.photobucket.com/albums/a572/paparumbo/_73444875_1_1769-map-krimea2_zpsf5362524.jpg)
This 1769 map shows the Crimean peninsula in the centre, in yellow for Turkey and Little Tartary; Russia is shown in blue
That lasted until Russia's Catherine the Great (seen below) took it from the Tatars, annexed it and made it part of the Russian Empire
(http://i1284.photobucket.com/albums/a572/paparumbo/_73434366_2_-catherine_976_zps07fb8e21.jpg)
And there it stayed, part of Russia, right up until 1954 when the Soviet leader Nikita Khrushchev, on a whim, gifted it to Ukraine.
(http://i1284.photobucket.com/albums/a572/paparumbo/_73434367_3-_crimea---ukraine_russia__zps44a8fa37.jpg)
The Crimean Autonomous Republic inside the Russian Federation is shown neighbouring the Ukrainian Republic inside the Soviet Union, on the left in pink, and the Russian Federation inside the Soviet Union in green in this 1932 map.
That didn't matter when this was all Soviet territory.
But in 1991 the Soviet Union collapsed. And overnight, Russia and Ukraine became separate countries with Crimea still in Ukraine.
(http://i1284.photobucket.com/albums/a572/paparumbo/_73444877_5-ukraineindie_zpsb538eec9.jpg)
This 1996 map of Ukraine is how the country looks at present
As for the main part of Ukraine, it's always been pulled two ways. Western Ukraine has always been tied to Europe, for good reason.
Take Lviv - as its now called - in the far west.
(http://i1284.photobucket.com/albums/a572/paparumbo/_73445576_5-ukraine_lviv2_zps4a4dbd4e.jpg)
On the map above it has the Russian spelling IbBIB. It remained part of Soviet Ukraine, known as Lvov - a Russified version of its name - until the USSR collapsed in 1991, when it reverted to the name of Lviv.
(http://i1284.photobucket.com/albums/a572/paparumbo/_73434370_6leopoldstatcu_976_zpsf5ed4537.jpg)
On this map of 1775, where it is labelled as Leopol, it had become part of the Austrian empire, where it was also known as Lemberg.
And in 1940, by now part of Poland, it came under Soviet rule, part of a carve-up - a secret deal - between Hitler and Stalin.
(http://i1284.photobucket.com/albums/a572/paparumbo/_73445316_molotov_zps191b33c4.jpg)
The above map shows the annexation that was included in the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact of 1939
Many Crimean Tatars were deported by Stalin in 1944 at the end of World War Two, accused of collaborating with Nazi Germany. They were later allowed to return home, but remain wary of coming under Moscow's rule again.
Some Ukrainian nationalists even saw Stalin as a bigger enemy than Hitler. That's why there's still so much suspicion of Moscow, the old occupying power.
And that's why we keep hearing President Putin warning of the threat from right-wing extremists in Western Ukraine.
Old fears and mistrust - still shaping attitudes today.
Yet the further east you go in Ukraine, the more people see Russia not as enemy, but part of the family.
(http://i1284.photobucket.com/albums/a572/paparumbo/_73445317_8-full-colour-wide---crop-2_zpse384f3ad.jpg)
In this 18th Century map, Russia's lands go right up to Kiev.
And Kiev is where Russia started a thousand years ago, the birthplace of the Russian state and the Russian Orthodox Church.
It's almost sacred. That's why President Putin doesn't want to let it go.
And those deep seated emotions are what make this crisis so dangerous.
The worry is that if Ukraine's maps do need to be redrawn again, it may only provoke new violence.
Maps courtesy of the British Library in London, which has one of the world's greatest collections of maps and cartographic materials
Source BBC
Very interesting history lesson. Thanks for that.
The amount of $'s owed by Ukraine to Russia is starggering. Not sure how they can repay, no matter which way the country goes.
QuoteAnd there it stayed, part of Russia, right up until 1954 when the Soviet leader Nikita Khrushchev, on a whim, gifted it to Ukraine.
LOL! "Whim." Right. One has to wonder what the real story was...
Quote from: micjer on March 14, 2014, 12:20:13 PM
Very interesting history lesson. Thanks for that.
The amount of $'s owed by Ukraine to Russia is starggering. Not sure how they can repay, no matter which way the country goes.
I know how They can eliminate all financial debt... Just sayin'.
"I know how They can eliminate all financial debt... Just sayin'."
Well Amy, you and I both know about the pounding hammer that national debt is.
just like money, its a fabrication.
Untill each each nation tells the international banking system to F>ck off it will always cripple the world.
its designed to do just that.
to stop emerging states from progressing. and keeping the financial sector buoyant with debt bonds to trade so the wealthy stay wealthy.
its a game, and a sick one at that.
Quote from: Elvis Hendrix on March 14, 2014, 05:24:37 PM
"I know how They can eliminate all financial debt... Just sayin'."
Well Amy, you and I both know about the pounding hammer that national debt is.
just like money, its a fabrication.
Untill each each nation tells the international banking system to F>ck off it will always cripple the world.
its designed to do just that.
to stop emerging states from progressing. and keeping the financial sector buoyant with debt bonds to trade so the wealthy stay wealthy.
its a game, and a sick one at that.
If everybody owes everybody and the world owes Jupiter..
Couldn't they just erase debt and debts owed? like globally?..
Hypothetically..In day dream land..
Its not a dream sinny, its the answer.
take the Iceland model and run with it.
if money is produced by a government anyway. why charge yourself interest on your own money. its a scam. Get rid of interest. that's the answer.write down debt, just make the digits disappear of the screen. its that easy.
Quote from: Elvis Hendrix on March 14, 2014, 05:24:37 PM
"I know how They can eliminate all financial debt... Just sayin'."
Well Amy, you and I both know about the pounding hammer that national debt is.
just like money, its a fabrication.
Untill each each nation tells the international banking system to F>ck off it will always cripple the world.
its designed to do just that.
to stop emerging states from progressing. and keeping the financial sector buoyant with debt bonds to trade so the wealthy stay wealthy.
its a game, and a sick one at that.
They can only maintain hold as long as They control energy - which is all money accounts for. If They lose hold of that, if free energy emerges, They will slip into oblivion. And They know it very well. Thus the avid efforts to suppress all free energy tech.
Yep, I'm in agreement of the Icelandic method. Hail Iceland!
That's a nation I'd like to be part of..
Quote from: Elvis Hendrix on March 14, 2014, 05:53:45 PM
Its not a dream sinny, its the answer.
take the Iceland model and run with it.
if money is produced by a government anyway. why charge yourself interest on your own money. its a scam. Get rid of interest. that's the answer.write down debt, just make the digits disappear of the screen. its that easy.
That does not solve for ruthless and devious psychopaths gaining the upper hand again though many machinations. As long as We are accounting for energy, all "resets" of a money system will evolve and emerge with these sorts in change and enslaving Us.
Amy, not really. If there is no way to charge for the act of utilising a tool
That is at our disposal. Ie money.
Then the point is moot.
Of course despots will always exist.
Let them chase money. If they can't benefit from the debt of others..
Then they are no more powerfull than you our I.
The worth of a dollar or a pound or whatever you want to call it must be valued by the goods and services it manifests.
There is your worth.
If a country can't manage itself and grow or make or produce then it will falter..... Let it falter till it learns.
It will grow because of that.
Economics is a science of self. It thinks it's bigger and more mysterious than it actually is.
Anyway back to the thread.
Be thankfull you are in your beds tonight.
Coz this is happening now.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ffYW3nlBwZk
http://youtu.be/ffYW3nlBwZk
Quote from: Elvis Hendrix on March 14, 2014, 08:14:26 PM
Amy, not really. If there is no way to charge for the act of utilising a tool
That is at our disposal. Ie money.
Then the point is moot.
Of course despots will always exist.
Let them chase money. If they can't benefit from the debt of others..
Then they are no more powerfull than you our I.
The worth of a dollar or a pound or whatever you want to call it must be valued by the goods and services it manifests.
There is your worth.
If a country can't manage itself and grow or make or produce then it will falter..... Let it falter till it learns.
It will grow because of that.
Economics is a science of self. It thinks it's bigger and more mysterious than it actually is.
The tool is an accounting tool (accounting for the meaningful energy We Humans expend) that also promotes the most ruthless into the lion's share of control of the tool. Take away the need for the tool and "despots" have nothing to pay toadies with. What are Individuals going to do to gain control over Others without the ability to pay Others to do Their bidding?
Amy.
What colour is the sky in your world .
Storm Clouds gathering
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWkfpGCAAuw
Not sure why my embed won't work..
Quote from: Elvis Hendrix on March 14, 2014, 10:12:31 PM
Amy.
What colour is the sky in your world .
Depends on the day. If no chemtrails, it verges on the blue I remember as a child. Add the trails and then... A bluish-steel gray. Why do You ask?
Do You insinuate that My research and grasp of the the foundations of economics - an effort spanning 50 years - is a fantasy?
Quote from: Sinny on March 14, 2014, 10:16:29 PM
Storm Clouds gathering
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWkfpGCAAuw
Not sure why my embed won't work..
Gotta remove the "s":
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWkfpGCAAuw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWkfpGCAAuw
Quote from: Sinny on March 14, 2014, 10:16:29 PM
Storm Clouds gathering
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWkfpGCAAuw
Not sure why my embed won't work..
Maybe because of the "s" in the https - I will give it a try:~~~~~ yes it worked!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWkfpGCAAuw
Aha, thanks guys
Quote from: Amaterasu on March 14, 2014, 10:20:55 PM
Depends on the day. If no chemtrails, it verges on the blue I remember as a child. Add the trails and then... A bluish-steel gray. Why do You ask?
Do You insinuate that My research and grasp of the the foundations of economics - an effort spanning 50 years - is a fantasy?
Just jokin with you, you know me by now. Hopefully and graciously :)
Quote from: Elvis Hendrix on March 15, 2014, 02:27:21 AM
Just jokin with you, you know me by now. Hopefully and graciously :)
Fair enough, love. [smile] Perhaps I'm a bit bristly. [grin]
Hey Sinny, that video you posted was very enlightening.
I had a feeling there was more to this situation. No wonder the Ruskies are
beating their chests.
thanks for that.
It's StormCloudsGathering that deserves the thanks..Each and everytime he kills the mainstream media :D
Here's the Caspian Report:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v6jHhzj08yQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zL5kd8hPluo
http://youtu.be/zL5kd8hPluo