Double jeopardy

[undo11]

holy toledo! 
a few hours ago a news bulletin was put out that obama was ordering the embassy in vatican city to be closed and the members to be moved to a building elsewhere in italy.  he said, "it isn't safe" (referring to vatican city)

then, a few hours later, another report comes out saying the pope is also moving himself out of vatican city.

uh. whoa.

[zorgon]

Really?  Wow  Volcano?

[zorgon]

Obama administration plans to close Vatican embassy in shock move

The U.S. State department is planning to close its embassy to the Holy See, citing security concerns without naming a specific threat. Ireland announced its decision to shut its embassy to the Vatican in 2011.

The U.S. embassy, which has been in operation since 1984, will be swallowed up by the larger U.S. embassy to Italy, The Daily Beast reports.

Most countries have two embassies in Italy – one to the country of Italy and another to the Holy See, a sovereign nation within Rome. Some, including the U.S., have a third embassy to the United Nations Organization headquartered in the city.

The U.S. embassy to the Holy See is scheduled to move to the American embassy to Italy in January 2015 and will inhabit a small annex with a separate entrance.

Conservative Catholics in the U.S. oppose the move. James Nicholson, a former American ambassador to the Holy See from 2001 to 2005, told Vatican expert John Allen that the move was "a massive downgrade."

Speaking to Allen for the National Catholic Reporter, Nicholson said: "It's turning this embassy into a stepchild of the embassy to Italy."

"The Holy See is a pivot point for international affairs and a major listening post for the United States," he said, "and to shoehorn [the U.S. delegation] into an office annex inside another embassy is an insult to American Catholics and to the Vatican."

Former Bush envoys Francis Rooney and Mary Ann Glendon as well as Raymond Flynn, the first Clinton ambassador, and Thomas Melady, who served the first President Bush, also object to the move.

The Vatican has long insisted that countries with diplomatic missions to both Italy and the Holy See maintain autonomous embassies.

Sources inside the American embassy in Rome have said the embassies will maintain separate functions, reports The Daily Beast. While the U.S. embassy to Italy has a strategic role in American activities in Europe, Africa and the Middle East, its embassy to the Holy See has a distinct role in church affairs.

The action of the embassy to the Holy See follows a similar move by the U.S. embassy to the United Nations Organization, which was moved to the embassy grounds in 2012. Other major countries have also consolidated their embassies, including Israel, the United Kingdom and the Netherlands. Ireland, which closed its embassy to the Holy See entirely, relies on visiting envoys to maintain diplomatic relations.

The Vatican has not commented on the reports of the American embassy closure, but reports say it is unlikely to protest the relocation.

http://www.irishcentral.com/news/Obama-administration-plans-to-close-Vatican-embassy-in-shock-move--233288751.html

[zorgon]

Vatican Says No, Non Preoccuparti, They're Not Worried: The Pope Is Safe

November 14, 2013 By Kathy Schiffer 3 Comments
Earlier today, I reported on a story which appeared in the Catholic Herald, quoting Italian magistrate Nicola Gratteri.  Gratteri believed that the Pope's life was in danger due to his recent criticisms of organized crime.

Now, though, the Vatican has addressed Gratteri's fears directly and has dismissed the judge's concerns.  Father Federico Lombardi, director of the Vatican Press Office, told ABC News,
There is no concrete reason that would lead us to worry.  There is no reason to fear alarmism.  We are very calm.

It is business-as-usual in Vatican City.

And after all, the Pope has his own personal security force:  The Swiss Guard has been protecting the pontiff since the late fifteenth century.

http://www.patheos.com/blogs/kathyschiffer/2013/11/vatican-says-no-non-preoccuparti-theyre-not-worried-the-pope-is-safe/

[undo11]

Really?  Wow  Volcano?

i dunno!  it's just so, so, biblical.  hopefully, it's just cause it needs to be bug sprayed or something. 

i'm still in shock.  when i heard obama was moving the embassy, i was like wow, strange.  but the pope, too?  now THAT's weird

[undo11]

here's what confused me
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-25102720

guess i read it wrong lol! 

[Sinny]

It was prophesied that this fellow, or just the one after would be the last Pope... And now big changes arise.

[sky otter]

well the pope has been busy


http://worldnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/11/25/21611511-could-putin-pope-francis-visit-mark-beginning-of-end-of-centuries-old-rift

Could Putin-Pope Francis visit mark beginning of end of centuries-old rift?

By Claudio Lavanga, NBC News Producer
ROME — Pope Francis and Russian President Vladimir Putin met Monday amid high expectations that their visit could mark the beginning of the end of the centuries-old rift between the Roman Catholic and Eastern Orthodox churches.

Since becoming pontiff in March, Francis has met with more than a dozen heads of state, and Putin met with both of his predecessors Pope Benedict XVI and Pope John Paul II.

But this meeting comes at a unique time.

"What's making (this visit) different this time is who he will meet: a pope, Francis, who for the first time is not from Europe," said Andrea Tornielli, a Vatican expert who writes for the Italian daily "La Stampa."

......

Putin traveled to Rome followed by a delegation of 11 ministers and countless delegates who sped towards the Vatican in 50 cars that sent Rome into a massive gridlock — and he was still 50 minutes late to the meeting. 



....................................



http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/breaking/chi-pope-capitalism-a-new-tyranny-20131126,0,7003162.story



Pope calls unbridled capitalism 'a new tyranny'
'We ... have to say thou shalt not to an economy of exclusion and inequality. Such an economy kills'

[deuem]

America was founded on the division of Church and State, Please move out! Should not have been there in the first place. All Gubermints use this religion tie to keep power. There should be no ties.

Ties bring in people who then want to control the gubermint and the biggest religion wins. Just like the biggest corporations win. I am not against yours or anyones religion. I just don't think it should have attachments to gubermint. We are not doing what we said. The old church/state idea.

Look at what the German gubermint did. They added a religion tax on every single person who works so the churches would not falter. It is a deduction on you pay slip.  Forced religion by a gubermint to control the masses.  How long before Obama care includes 10% to religion or yee get tossed in the clink. Religo-care is next....

Ok, please don't hang Deuem, it is just an opinion...

Deuem

[burntheships]

Well, its been a busy month for The Pope,
take a look at this one....


Pope Francis Calls
For Power To Move Away From Vatican

Pope Francis has called for power in the Catholic Church to be devolved
away from the Vatican,  in the first major work he has written in the role.

Now, that would be a major shift, one that The Pope describes as leaving
the church "bruised, hurting and dirty". And remember that
Pope Francis is a Jesuit. 

"preferred a Church that was "bruised, hurting and dirty because
it has been out on the streets, rather than a Church which is unhealthy from
being confined and from clinging to its own security". 

This is very very interesting indeed. I am curious about this,
timed with a few other items of interest concerning The
Vatican, and The Catholic Church, along with a
few predictions come to mind!

What does he know, that we dont know???

[Amaterasu]

America was founded on the division of Church and State, Please move out! Should not have been there in the first place. All Gubermints use this religion tie to keep power. There should be no ties.

True, but Our lawful government sits abandoned since 1871, and in its place is a corporation masquerading as government, and IT will do what profits the OWNERS.

Ties bring in people who then want to control the gubermint and the biggest religion wins. Just like the biggest corporations win. I am not against yours or anyones religion. I just don't think it should have attachments to gubermint. We are not doing what we said. The old church/state idea.

Turns out ALL the "governments" are corporations with some very few exceptions (mainly the ones We war with).  And many of the owners are also owners of "religion, inc."  The RCC is a corporation!  It's all a racket.

Look at what the German gubermint did. They added a religion tax on every single person who works so the churches would not falter. It is a deduction on you pay slip.  Forced religion by a gubermint to control the masses.  How long before Obama care includes 10% to religion or yee get tossed in the clink. Religo-care is next....

It's ALL re-legion.  All commerce and admiralty law.  It doesn't matter if the re-legion is of the corporate state or the corporate church.  It's all the same in the end.

Ok, please don't hang Deuem, it is just an opinion...

Deuem

Won't hang Ya.  Just add to Your knowledge base.  [smile]  Hope You can watch the vids I offer in My fraud of the OPPT thread.

[ArMaP]

America was founded on the division of Church and State, Please move out!

The Vatican is a state like any other, having an embassy there doesn't mean that there are any special ties.

[Elvis Hendrix]

[WarToad]

The Vatican is a state like any other, having an embassy there doesn't mean that there are any special ties.

Agreed.  And considering the tremendous amount of leverage and political sway the Vatican has, cutting all ties would be a poor chess move in the game of global politics.

Edit:  I would also note there hasn't been any actual downgrade, rather a combining of resources.  There is sill an Ambassador to the Vatican there.