Farside buildings

[undo11]

"Can't be" and "Exactly" are sarcasims towards the PT B's Undo11. FYI

Ahhh, okay. 
i really like this topic.  been lurking on it cause i find it interesting. 

[johnlear]

Keep in mind that there is no bigger, greater, more important secret than the fact that there is a  civilization on the moon.

The U.S. Navy has known about it since the 1870's which is why Admiral Simon Newcomb went to Paris in 1870 to trash the reputation of Peter Andreas Hanson, a highly decorated Danish astronomer because Hanson, at the 1856 Astronomical Society meeting in Paris, proposed that there might be life on the moon. Since then (or before) these astronomers have agreed with him:

William Herschel
Mestrius Plutarchus
Nicolaus Copernicus
Aristarchus of Samos
John Wilkens
Hans Kepler
Peter Andreas Hansen
William Leitch
John Herschel
William Whewell
Asaph Hall
Mikhail Vasin
Alexander Shcherbakov
Johann Hieronymus Schroeter

You, as human beings, have been consistently lied to for your entire life.

I can't think of one major discovery concerning space that wasn't filtered through the MSDG
Mainstream Scientists Disinformation Group, who gave it a spin more in line with the cover story.

Zorgon put this forum together so that we can discuss things without being attacked by a mob of sock puppets throwing disinformation and pure nonsense into the mix.

There should be no doubt in anybody's mind now that the Apollo missions to the moon were HOAXED. They never went. It was a scam. And the scam was perpetrated SPECIFICALLY to reinforce the idea that the moon was just a cold, black, airless void. Thats what the mission was for.

There is no possibility that NAZA or the government will ever release any facts or information related to the civilization on the moon. No more than there will ever be a disclosure of ET's. It's a secret and they mean to keep it that way.

And oh,btb, the way that they will keep it a secret is to appeal to the common sense of the average moron who still thinks Neil Armstrong and crew went to the moon. And why are these morons so sure we went to the moon?  Because they saw it on TV.

[ArMaP]

I can't figure out what you have against the moons gravity being .7% that of earths.

I have nothing against, if it can be proved.

That would explain all of the hoaxed photos that NAZA has presented us.

What hoaxed photos? I have seen hoaxed photos but I have mostly seen photos that people say are hoaxed for some reason, with no real signs of being hoaxed.

Your argument that they flew a curved fight path is straight from Jim Oberg and is total nonsense.

I didn't say that. So, how did they got to the Moon, did they moved in straight line from the US to the Moon?

And you did get  that from Oberg.

No.

Why can't we allow he truth to seep in? There is a  breathable atmosphere on the moon and there are likely 1.5 to 2.0 billion people up there and that is just on the surface.

I would like to see the truth, but I just don't accept anyone's word as the truth just because they say so.

Wouldn't a breathable atmosphere be visible when the Moon passes in front of the Sun?

Have you got something against moon people?

I don't have a thing against them, regardless of them being real or not.

Who do you think lives in all those structures up there?

Even if those structures exist as inhabitable structures, that doesn't mean they they are inhabited.

Who do you think is doing all that mining?

That supposed mining can be done by machines, if it's more than just imagination.

Have you read Howard Mengers book "From Outer Space" about his trip to the moon? Why was Menger then a special consultant to the Pentagon?

No, I haven't read that book.

Every planet and moon in our solar system has a civilization on it.

No problems with that, but I would like to see some real evidence.

There are 40 planets in our solar system.

Really? Are there real evidences of that?

The universe is infinite.

Good for it.

Both of Einsteins theories, general and special have been debunked. Newton's law of gravitation has been debunked.

What's the connection between that and people on the Moon, a breathable atmosphere or mining?

Do you do any reading besides punching a keyboard and watching a screen?

No, I'm just an illiterate person, I just hit the keyboard randomly and some things appear on the screen.
Do you have a reading list that you can share?

You do know that the web is purely a disinformation source?

Yes, I know that, and I think I am seeing that.

Come on ArMap. Pull your socks up ,lad.

I'm barefoot at the moment, old man.

Edited to add: After rereading my post I think I may have been too harsh, sorry if I was.

[johnlear]

I'm barefoot at the moment, old man.

.

I can lead you to water Armap, but I can't make you think!

[Sgt.Rocknroll]

John it's good to see you posting here again, haven't heard from you in awhile. Hope everythings good with you.

[johnlear]

Armaps course to the moon

[bobathome]

Both of Einsteins theories, general and special have been debunked. Newton's law of gravitation has been debunked.
tsk,,tsk,,tsk,,,
actually Higgs Bosson,, confermed once again.
Wave Theory is not a theory anymore.
we can no longer think in the perspective of Linear Flight.
it would be like appliying Artillery shells too ,,gravity,,
ohh wait ya that is exactly what it is,, only on a ,,
larger scale,,
lets say water in a bucket,, first,,
and go from there.
  Me.

[bobathome]

Actually when i seen Farside i thought of Jim Unger  " Herman "
passed away,,,he was 72??? wow.
sorry off topic.
good stuff

[deuem]

Hello all, After reading the above I take it that the majority would like to contain the conversation here and not worry about the Far side buildings going off topic for awhile. Continue like the way we would talk to each other as if all around a table. Ideas flow out that need to be addressed. One affects the other and if the foundation is shaky so is all the rest. If there is anything I can do to help nail down some of these question, I will be sure to help out.

Deuems Step 1:
I have started a CAD file on the Moon Earth Sun relationship in full scale in Kilometers from data I have researched on the web. ( this is all I have in China ) I will add numbers to my model and work out some numbers and present them. If any of you find a wrong number please let me know and I can change it and update. Sarge should also be able to do this in his sleep so he can check any work or add some of his own.

I found a web site for history information on Apogee, Perigee, New Moon and Full Moon data.
I hope that John or Zorgon can let me know if this site is valued or trash.

http://www.fourmilab.ch/earthview/pacalc.html

Attached is their chart for 1969



There are 4 dates of interest to our discussion.

Apogee on July 13 at 406,601km
New Moon on July 14 at an unknown distance
Perigee on July 28 at 357,925km
Full Moon on July 29 at an unknown distance.

If any of the above is in question please advise me and I can change the data. This data affects everything from here in. This is another reason why I am holding the next step back.

I am attaching an excel spread sheet of the numbers I used to calculate my CAD model. ( For any readers not sure of what CAD is or does. It means Computer Aided Drawing. It is a very accurate method of making Engineering drawings within the computer. Even at full scale. If I draw a line a mile long. That line is a mile long in the computer. So everything in this model is to full scale including the 93 million miles to the Sun. )



I will give some time before printing step 2.
On the personal side of this, ( My opinion ) I have already drawn my Orbit map once and I can see that the neutral point is always shifting from minute to minute. We can actually draw in the ellipse for it once we determine and agree on the correct math.

Deuem

[Sgt.Rocknroll]

What are you using as your origin point? Everything has an origin point i.e. 0,0,0 which represents the X, Y, Z of any particular object. If you created a 3d model of your calculations, having an Earth model (to scale) a Moon model (to scale) what would be your origin point? The Earth, the Moon or the Sun. Or some other point? I can create an exact model of the Earth and the Moon and the Sun and put them together with the Sun as 0,0,0. Will your calculations and numbers reflect that scenario? Just for my own information.

P.S. CAD stands for Computer Aided Drafting not Drawing. There is a difference. Anyone can draw, drafting is an Art. Not everyone can draft.
Later it became CADD (Computer Aided Drafting & Design) but I prefer CAD....

[Pimander]

I didn't say that. So, how did they got to the Moon, did they moved in straight line from the US to the Moon?

Can you think of any reason why they would not take a straight path once out of Earth's orbit except when approaching lunar orbit to fine tune the trajectory?  Any other path would be stupid surely?

[Sgt.Rocknroll]

The 4DMoon!...(this may be old news to some but I thought it was cool)..

Short video of some software I found that I think is fun and interesting to use.



I've installed it and it not only runs Apollo 11,12,14,15,17 Lunokhod 1 & 2, it also has the 'alien' spaceship that was discussed here previously. (you can actually move around the spacecraft in real time).

The cool thing about this software is its interactive. You can actually move to any point on  the moon in real time.

Its from an Italian firm and some of the install instructions are in Italian but it's easy to install and fun as hell...



P.S. You can move around in real time in the areas that are pre-programmed..i.e. the mission I stated above. Once you get to the Apollo 11 site, you can then move around in real time...

[deuem]

What are you using as your origin point? Everything has an origin point i.e. 0,0,0 which represents the X, Y, Z of any particular object. If you created a 3d model of your calculations, having an Earth model (to scale) a Moon model (to scale) what would be your origin point? The Earth, the Moon or the Sun. Or some other point? I can create an exact model of the Earth and the Moon and the Sun and put them together with the Sun as 0,0,0. Will your calculations and numbers reflect that scenario? Just for my own information.

P.S. CAD stands for Computer Aided Drafting not Drawing. There is a difference. Anyone can draw, drafting is an Art. Not everyone can draft.
Later it became CADD (Computer Aided Drafting & Design) but I prefer CAD....

I am not using the 3D, just 2D for this layout. You can do 3D if you want too, that would make a nice model. I would hold off until we pass 2 sets of numbers. Then go for it! I would use the sun as 0,0,0  If you ever needed the model for anything else that starting point would be the master. I started with the sun and worked my way out. It would be easy to reset the suns center to 0,0,0 if and when I added a Z axis. For now x-y is as far as I want to get.  There are a lot of numbers coming out that I think we all should agree on first otherwise there will be a lot of fix up work.

It is that left hand that makes all the mistakes. W instead of FT. Yea, it is Drafting, An oops for me! I get caught using the word drawing because then I don't have to explain what Drafting is. When I started we only had drafting boards. My first CAD program had no mouse. All text. I also prefer the word CAD. I added that note for readers who don't know what it is.

I drew the sun, went 90 degrees to the right, drew the earth at 93 million miles and so on. I used all metric. The drawing is set in kilometers. At a later point in time when needed we can calculate the Earths orbit relative to the sun and draw in the real orbit path.  For this part of the problem I only added the sun so it would be in the program. As far as I see, our current problem has no affect on the math. If it does we will have to take another step, actually a lot of steps and figure out where the Earth was then in its orbit. I figured I could always group edit the Earth Moon and move it later. So at this point in time the Earth has no relation to the actual Sun orbit, just 90 degrees to the right and the average distance.

Sarge, what I am waiting for is for one of the guys/gals who know the Apogee/Perigee real well to step up and agree or toss out that web site and the numbers. On Moon numbers it seems like everyone out there has a different set. I am hoping that as a team we can all agree on every number presented or worked out. Play the cards face up as I say. So no one can say we hid anything. I hope you agree.  I think you will like this. A lot of problems can be worked out with these models and shown well.  Can you do simple screen shots, I use the free program called "Snap Shot" In step 2, I will post Snap Shots along the way. I hope you can do the same. If it is too much for this tread we can move it to another thread or my research thread and just put the answers here.


I also see ArMap and others going at it on the flight path. NASA illustrations screw with our minds because they do the entire flight path in one print. It happens over days.

We can add that later after this set up is done. At this point in time I would say it is a tangent to a tanget that will be there 3 days later. Never center to center. If gravity has any affect we can add those curves in. To me it looks like a straight line that plots out to a curve over 3 days to put on one paper.
Thanks for your interest, Deuem

[Sgt.Rocknroll]

I am not using the 3D, just 2D for this layout. You can do 3D if you want too, that would make a nice model. I would hold off until we pass 2 sets of numbers. Then go for it! I would use the sun as 0,0,0  If you ever needed the model for anything else that starting point would be the master. I started with the sun and worked my way out. It would be easy to reset the suns center to 0,0,0 if and when I added a Z axis. For now x-y is as far as I want to get.  There are a lot of numbers coming out that I think we all should agree on first otherwise there will be a lot of fix up work.

I was thinking since the universe is in 3d and not 2d that it would make a difference in calculations. Not that interested in flight paths... and I don't know that much about it, just curious.

It is that left hand that makes all the mistakes. W instead of FT. Yea, it is Drafting, An oops for me! I get caught using the word drawing because then I don't have to explain what Drafting is. When I started we only had drafting boards. My first CAD program had no mouse. All text. I also prefer the word CAD. I added that note for readers who don't know what it is.

I wasn't trying to 'catch you' at anything. Just pointing out the difference. And yes I'm a draftsman first and formost, an original lead-spreader.
my first Cad system was all keyboard, Textronics CRT'S on the Auto-trol system. (1978),,,

Sarge, what I am waiting for is for one of the guys/gals who know the Apogee/Perigee real well to step up and agree or toss out that web site and the numbers. On Moon numbers it seems like everyone out there has a different set. I am hoping that as a team we can all agree on every number presented or worked out. Play the cards face up as I say. So no one can say we hid anything. I hope you agree.  I think you will like this. A lot of problems can be worked out with these models and shown well.  Can you do simple screen shots, I use the free program called "Snap Shot" In step 2, I will post Snap Shots along the way. I hope you can do the same. If it is too much for this tread we can move it to another thread or my research thread and just put the answers here.

Snap Shot..huh...sounds interesting. Thanks I'll  check it out...

Deuem, my interest lay in the structures/civilizations on the moon and not how we may or may not have gotten there... I enjoy reading your posts and the comments from other members...

Keep it coming...The passion for this is incredible.

Rock,,,Peace

[deuem]

Hey Sarge, unless one of the big guns steps in and adds the Sun, I think we can do this test with just the Earth/Moon plane. If we were at New or full moon it might be worth adding. There are also a lot more variables that could come into this picture and it could get out of hand. I think we should start simple and work up.

1978, All keys also, then you are older than I thought you were. All the young kids would not know how to use CAD with out a mouse. For Readers: Yes there was a day when computers had no mice. Everything was done with key board commands. Yes, we are old! But still kicking!

I run snap on a lot of stuff including freeze frame videos I can not download. I send all the snaps to a Trash later folder on my main screen then move or trash as needed.  This is very good for making reports/email with CAD clips/pictures, so I also use it for work so I don't have to email the entire drawing.

I understand your passion on the far side buildings and would never ask you to stop. This topic came up and I think it is worth a visit for us. I would like to drive this down to simplistic terms that anyone can read and understand. With John and Zorgons help, I think we can do it and put it in pictures instead of being locked up in formulas. Just an idea! Maybe at the end you can make one of you movies.

Deuem