Martyn Stubbs 99 Proof of UFOs: #1-STS-63 examined by a UFO

[Martyn Stubbs]

zorgon, thanks for doing the work & I have to think more about our shared 'critter'  info before I jump in.

I take it then that there is a general agreement here that this video does show a UFO.....so we all are at the point where some say it is a man made mechanical craft or it is an alien mechanical craft, & others say either organic as a living 'critter' or constructed  organic craft.

Well that is fine but all I can hope for here is that everyone can SEE that an unknown object crosses over the shuttle & then this object moves up the right side of the shuttle as the Russian camera looks down.

So what are the Russians saying when they zoom in?
Does anybody care?
It can not be ice..right?
It's not debris, not the CanadaArm, so what does that?

So this video has a UFO. We all agree!?? So this should matter.

[zorgon]

zorgon...You are looking at the same things that I am. Specifically Plasma.

Yeah we are the two main proponents of the Plasma Critters. Ever since I read Trevor's article and saw his images from the 50's I was on that. I know you are a friend of Trevors as well

Sorry for all the noise here lately... seems there is always an Opera waiting in the wings. I will be taking a new direction over the next few weeks to change that. Glad you popped in

One point about the plasma critters... when we started we were the nut cases. Today main stream science is finding out that plasma lifeforms are not only possible but likely  Do a google search for "Plasma Life Forms" and you will see

That said...

But 1st, I feel that the problem with this subject is always the hang-up everyone has with craft having to be mechanical.

Yes we are up against a "I WANT TO BELIEVE" syndrome that desperately wishes it all to be Alien Spaceships here to save the world and solve man kinds problems for us.

My personal opinion is that the vast majority fit into the plasmoids theory and only a few fit the solid craft theory

I have noticed that many top UFOlogist are starting to lean towards Critters.  People like Jacque Vallee, Robert Bigelow (and the rest of the Aviary) add the inter dimensional aspect ( I will cover that soon)

I watched the final show for this year, of the series "Falling Skies"...  & they had the correct idea. An organic craft..everything connected via a central nervous system. The lead had to figure out how to move it & pulled on various tendons to 'drive'.

FARSIDE has the same concept  A living craft.  Several other shows have used the same theme.  And today NASA and the Air Force are working on living, morphing skins for our own craft

The thing is whether they are plasma Critters, or living spacecraft, or metallic ships with a plasma shield... they would all exhibit similar characteristics (ie glowing, blurry, etc)

And remember Babylon 5 had a "living craft" that the characters were all afraid off.etc...

yeah almost forgot that one   

Yet BIG box office is still "Transformers"! Giant machines. Same with the Matrix battle scenes. Man vs machine.

So the masses are being battered by mechanistic thinking & eat it up. I don't get this.!! So 'critter' thinking is weird for many. Just as 'ships from other planets' is still all the rage.

Oddly enough in Transformers they use the term "Planet Dirt"  That is very significant for us but the subject of another thread

I'm thinking that the organics are dimensional travelers, who can move about our solar system.

I agree, so did the Aviary

And yes, there are big variances in the NASA UFOs, as this object looks plasma free..as the 2nd. Space phenomena (type 2:streaks or 'fastwalkers') also appear plasma free.

Just because some are doesn't mean all must be  Not all our airplanes are stealth craft either

But here is my problem with the craft vs the critters

An Alien craft would require having come from vast distances (or other dimensions)  WHY would they appear in our skies by the hundreds to just flit about aimlessly in our skies, fluttering about literally like moths to a light. I refer to the swarms like the tether incident and the thousands of orbs seen daily that seem to have no substance or purpose

These types to me are the critter life forms that I believe have always been on earth and have been mistaken for other things

I can easily separate the types after years of study. I find it easy to say one is  a critter, another is likely a craft

We are a very vane species. We think we are important enough to warrant hundreds of daily visits from aliens that do nothing? Never once land, just zip round the skies

The real craft, like the 1952 Washington flap and some seen at A51  those are different and more likely real craft. They behave differently. The "Foo Fighters"  of WWII I class as the Ctritters. They seem curious, seem to have a basic intelligence. They are aware of us but I don't think we can communicate yet. They are harmless, but do set off EM proximity sensors a lot

The odd thing is Jim Oberg at ATS linked me to a NASA document written in the 60's that addressed the 'plasma phenomena that were plaguing NASA space craft ( Like the fireflies that Glenn saw) 

So we are dealing with THREE separate things here 1) The amoeba like plasma life forms 2) the )likely) alien craft either living or plasma shielded and 3) the hard craft using a different propulsion (and those seem the ones we are flying)

NASA also has a contractor paper dated 1961 that was a FINAL draft of Shielding concepts for space craft

[ArMaP]

You sound hostile!...

That was a consequence of the tone of your post, polite posts get polite answers.

Fast forward & watch the light move to the right. (I know you now know that now!) ..just saying again..

Well, you wrote "Just watch the UFO (the bright light) move above the shuttle... from left to right & then move up the shuttle. ", but I see nothing like that.

What I see at the start of the video (in those overexposed, yellowish images) is the shuttle with a bright light (that I suppose is part of the shuttle) below it, after that I see the shuttle, rotated 180º when compared with the start of the video, with the bright light above it (because of the 180º rotation) and a small light to the right. That light has an apparent movement from bottom to top of the frame from the first time I see it (at 04:27) up to near the end of the video (at 08:35), when it disappears from the frame.

So, what I see and described above, doesn't match what you said on your opening post, unless I missed or misunderstood something.

[zorgon]

There is also one UFO sighting from Florida

It was filmed for over 20 minutes

What is shows is a Critter giving birth   

Denise Stoner, MUFON Florida, agrees with me on that one

Tallahassee, Florida, September 05, 2005 - Critter giving 'Birth'
http://www.thelivingmoon.com/49ufo_files/03files2/Florida_Sept_05_2005.html

I will post the video but see the page as there is a lot of info on it



Stabalized



Stabalized Enhanced

[ArMaP]

I think I see now what you mean by a light moving from left to right, but that looks like lens flare.

[Martyn Stubbs]

The skeptics are focusing on videos they can at least try to explain..but I have noticed...even with those 99 FAQs...that Jim Oberg is ignoring videos like this  because they can not deny the authenticity of the video..

and there is not an alternative theory to this (& others videos)  when it is NOT ice & NOT debris.

I have checked everything that I have from Jim since I streamed the tether from a website on March 11 2000, & he has stuck to a specific group of videos, & is invisible (like right here, right now) when videos such as this one are posted.

[ArMaP]

So what are the Russians saying when they zoom in?

I understand some words of Russian, but I can't understand what they are saying, which is not surprising, as my knowledge of Russian is very limited.

Does anybody care?

I do.

It can not be ice..right?

I'm not sure what you're talking about, but I don't think there's any ice on that video.

So this video has a UFO. We all agree!?? So this should matter.

Almost.
It looks to me like there are two separate things on the video, a lens flare at the beginning and the light seen from the middle to the end of the video, which could be many things, including a flying object that I cannot identify.

[Martyn Stubbs]

I think I see now what you mean by a light moving from left to right, but that looks like lens flare.

No,no,no! Not a lens flare. But that is a great example of all there is to say about this object..other than a UFO...unknown.

[Martyn Stubbs]

ArMaP..check out the lower left of the picture after NASA goes to the shuttle camera, & look at the pulsing object..turn up the brightness if you have to, & please note that the object is in the same spot that we last see it from the Russian camera shooting above.

Look at the positions. Hope you see it & yes I do get things wrong...as you suggest!!

[zorgon]

zorgon, thanks for doing the work & I have to think more about our shared 'critter'  info before I jump in.

Take your time  Its been an ongoing project and I have yet to catch one 

I take it then that there is a general agreement here that this video does show a UFO.....so we all are at the point where some say it is a man made mechanical craft or it is an alien mechanical craft, & others say either organic as a living 'critter' or constructed  organic craft.

Yes we can all agree its a UFO  but many people tend to use "UFO" to mean "Alien Spacecraft"  automatically. I would say this is a good one. But then you have brought us MANY good ones over the years

In fact no one would have ever seen all those early UFO's had it not been for you intercepting the transmissions (And Jim Oberg would have been out of a job )

Well that is fine but all I can hope for here is that everyone can SEE that an unknown object crosses over the shuttle & then this object moves up the right side of the shuttle as the Russian camera looks down.

The thing is I made the same point on the STS 80 film  When they zoom in on the 'object" that is now nearly over the horizon. Considering that it is still visible so far away and the fact they zoom in for a last look is PROOF that it is NOT a small ice particle or debris  Skeptics always avoid that one

So what are the Russians saying when they zoom in?
Does anybody care?

I care but I don't speak Russian Two members here do  One is Oberg and the other is Sarkoy. I wouldn't trust Oberg to translate  and Sarkoy has not posted in a while  I WILL email him and see if he can translate for us

It can not be ice..right?
It's not debris, not the CanadaArm, so what does that?

I think the only person here that would say "It's ice or debris" is the guy you created 

So this video has a UFO. We all agree!?? So this should matter.

You know what the problem is Martyn?  Only a few of us still care... why? because in all these years we are no closer to actually toaching one than we were after Roswell.  People get tired. We all know they are covering up stuff, we keep getting hints and clues. I get real insiders leaking me real info, but at the end of the day I still have no SOLID proof that I can slap on the table and say HERE IT IS!!!

If you look around the UFO conventions you will hear about hundreds of crash retrievals  yet not one person has ever laid one scrap of that on the table (since Roswell) that I can touch.

It makes it hard for the average believer to keep up. Add to that and the scads of fakery these days... people just get tired. I don't blame them. I left here for a few months for the same reason AFTER I heard that presentation at the Atomic Museum in Vegas that featured John Alexander, Nick Pope, Charles Haltand the head of Blue Book (and one other I forget)

I listened to that and it was the same old mind games...  I did discover Nick Pope is a non believer. Charles did have more info on that sighting of his and John did slip a comment that most missed (even George Knapp... he said in passing... "By the way... we have tracked them by satellite" (meaning UFO's) That was it  just that simple slip  No one in the room picked up on it

I will buy the recording

[Martyn Stubbs]

zorgon...wow nice find. I posted a while back a TJC clip of a critter he shot in IR.
Its on my you tube channel FYI.

re:STS-63... the blue haze is is???

[Martyn Stubbs]

The blue haze is not a camera issue.

I do have some comments on what you just said re: proving UFOs.etc. but I must eat dinner. I know Nick Pope pretty well & note your comment...I feel very down when I here this stuff from the so called gatherings of the famous.

You know that I care.

[zorgon]

I feel very down when I here this stuff from the so called gatherings of the famous.

Well I think it's old age LOL and a fickle audience

The get to the point that they start to tell the audience what they want to hear. John Lear calls it "UFO disease"

Bill Uhouse and Bob Lazar are the only two I know that had ONE story to tell and stuck to that story. The rest all end up following the crowd and giving opinions on any old UFO story. Linda M Howe backed the drone story 100%. When it was shot down as a hoax she was dragged down with it

I need to redo my entire website. I have it in my head how to proceed now to focus on the good stuff. If you don't mind I would feature a lot of your videos

[spacemaverick]

Well I think it's old age LOL and a fickle audience

The get to the point that they start to tell the audience what they want to hear. John Lear calls it "UFO disease"

Bill Uhouse and Bob Lazar are the only two I know that had ONE story to tell and stuck to that story. The rest all end up following the crowd and giving opinions on any old UFO story. Linda M Howe backed the drone story 100%. When it was shot down as a hoax she was dragged down with it

I need to redo my entire website. I have it in my head how to proceed now to focus on the good stuff. If you don't mind I would feature a lot of your videos

Do you mean re-do Living moon?  Whew...that would be a huge undertaking.  I sense a change is coming across the board.  I think you mentioned a re-focus also on the forum?

[astr0144]

Just had a quick browse, seems an Interesting thread..hopefully not as involved as the last main one Martyn posted...with the tether...I lost track on that after so long and don't know what the conclusion was.. need to recheck it..

I see Jim Oberg is a main member on ATS...was it also said that he had worked for NASA or had connections there...

Did he eventually agree it was a UFO ?  or do some see or suggest  him as a disinfo agent...or is he just very hard to convince ...He seemed very knowlegable and very particular when it came to investigation...maybe more so than anyone else that Ive come across other than maybe ArMap ! 

With this one, from what I can see...when at 4 mins 30 we see the video of the space shuttle....there seems to be a dim light to the right on what we see....and its below what looks like the two lights that may seem like eyes..with a brighter light above..

Later on at 5 mins 16 secs... the camera moves towards that light on the right...for about 15 secs and then zooms back out..the light is now ABOVE the two lights (eyes)...is this because that light is moved or the shuttle has moved..

I do not see any obvious movement of either...

so I do not see the light on the right move towards the shuttle...if that is what you partly refer to as the UFO..or critter or whatever..

At about 5 min 42 we see the two images...and the one we were watching...I see what looks like something appear over the image that may be described as critter like..that covers a large part of the image when zoomed out..

as it later zooms back to the one image we had been observing... then I can see the object appear....at about the 7 min 24 secs...that seems initially larger and you can see it closer to the top brighter light then move downwards to the two lights that look like eyes..

the glare from the lights change and it makes it harder to compare...as to how it was earlier..
but it appears very large...not what Id have expected....

They zoom in on it at about 8 mins 10...and it becomes more clear..


Are we sure it is not something on the camera lens..

The video is not really crystal clear...and has a lot of distortions...

at one point i seem to be able to see what may be critters below the shuttle...but again that may be camera distortion or lighting issues...

if its none of these then yes I can see something.. that I may describe as jelly fish type....

with the recent claim to plankton being in space..maybe Jelly fish like creatures are there as well.

To translate the Russian... I am sure there are forums for Russians or students who study it..if they can be found..im sure someone would translate the russian talk on video..