Pegasus Research Consortium

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cqjn3mup1So

Can We make this happen?

Quote from: Amaterasu on June 21, 2013, 05:06:40 AM
Can We make this happen?

Sure any kid in first year physics in high school can blow up things with hydrogen :D

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d1/Electrolysis_Apparatus.png/376px-Electrolysis_Apparatus.png)

All you need is a car battery a tub of water and two empty soda bottles and some wire

(http://cdn.instructables.com/F4A/54HN/F5R8MQ53/F4A54HNF5R8MQ53.LARGE.gif)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X1c0m0auBcE

I like this one better..

PLASMA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ALFYm_6IlX8

Nice!  Thanks, z.  What I liked about the presentation in the OP was how specific and detailed it was.

Amy this is high school stuff. real easy. i'm surprised you ask if we can make this happen.
I'm not having a go at you so don't take offence I just thought everyone had played with
this stuff.

simple setup=9 volt battery, 2 pieces of pencil lead(graphite),2 wires,jam jar,water.
can you picture the setup?

Zorgon's plasma one is a little more complex, I think that's running a tungsten rod and will probably have frequency counting/creating software and a digital voltage supply. quite high tech but not out of our reach.

LOL!  I am sure We CAN make it happen.  Just threw that in there in hopes of motivating.  [smile]

Here is a method of getting Hydrogen and Oxygen from water at a very high rate.

In fact far faster than what is achieved on Earth at present...   ;)


(http://www.thelivingmoon.com/48matrix_traveller/images2/HydrogenHarvesting.gif)


Water Enters in from the Left, while Hydrogen & Oxygen passes out through the right.


This process involves a Plasma.

Anyone can build this with a little engineering knowledge.

The Process is achieved through water being placed between the plates of a VHV Capacitor.

One Plate is a mesh like construction, and insulated from the water, while the other Plate
is in contact with the water.


In the Above Animation, the Piston (Metal) is in contact with the water.

The other Plate (mesh like) is imbedded in the lower Ceramic housing.


A VHV is placed across the 2 Plates.


Remember the mesh like plate is Insulated from the Water.

The Plasma forms between the 2 Plates.

NOTE; IF both plates are exposed to the Water a Plasma does NOT form.

The Technique, involves the Mesh like plate being Insulated from the water.   :)

Very nice, Matrix!  Thank You for adding that!

Has a working model of this suggested electrolysis device ever been built?

Quote from: Eighthman on June 26, 2013, 12:50:50 PM
Has a working model of this suggested electrolysis device ever been built?

Yes. Back in the 1990's which was used in another project...

It is very easy to do yourself.

Use Perspex or other VHV insulation as the dielectric instead of ceramic.

Use an "inverter", driving an "ignition coil" for your VHV.

Lay the mesh (length of thin copper wire zigzagging "to and fro", forming the plate.
Make sure a gap exists between each pass of the wire) between two layers of insulation and use
as one plate of the capacitor.


(( In the Cylinder it was used, I wound a spiral around a Cylinder made of thin ceramic and reinforced
with an outer cylinder.
The open ended Spiral acted as one plate of the Capacitor.
The other Plate was a Solid Rod that entered the inner Cylinder being supported in a bush.
A 0.2 mm gap existed between the piston and the cylinder wall where the water was.
The water was converted to oxygen and hydrogen then back to water again repeatedly.
This then drove a crankshaft. ))


Lay a thin film of water on the upper insulation, then a conductive plate on top of the water to act
as the other plate of the Capacitor.

Now deliver one pulse from your ignition coil to this capacitor. (The VHV pulse is AC )

NO catalyst required !

The plasma manifests between the two plates in the water.   :)

Warning: Water converts extremely fast in this method to oxygen and hydrogen.
The expansion may be in excess of 2,000 : 1.
(Where in a petrol internal combustion engine it is only about 4 to 6 : 1 expansion)

So please use extreme caution !

I am having great doubt about this HV/Moving Piston Device because of what it would suggest, if real.

If any of us got hold of a free energy device,  we would hold in our hands the ability to upend the whole global financial system, crash the stock markets,  emasculate the Evil Bankers and re-order all of Middle East politics.

I could not resist such temptation - and given that I believe you wish to be a Benefactor of Humanity, I don't see how you could turn down such an opportunity.

Nevertheless, I am not a pathological skeptic and respectfully wish to consider your reply.  I have many years of experience with high voltages applied to deionized water cooling systems - in tetrodes and klystrons ( although that is DC and has no insulation, other than the ion-free water itself)

The Honea Police example is not clear as they may be using the water gas as an adjunct rather than a main (or only) supply.

I believe there is proof - suggested by JPL years ago- that adding H2 to a gasoline fed engine might be synergistic - increasing gas mileage by modulating the speed of the flame front.  Of course,  you can't legally experiment with this idea because Federal law prohibits any modification of pollution devices ( reminds me of "Three Felonies A Day")

There are some guys that claimed to replicate what Meyer claimed but their videos seem to disappear mysteriously !

I am certain that THEY don't want Us to have the info.  Not surprised vids keep disappearing!

Saw some posts at Pegasus Yahoo Group on HOH gas by our resident mad scientist :P

HOH gas or Brown's Gas is dangerous as the H and O are combined already and can explode in seconds like the Hindenberg. It is much safer and more efficient to keep the H and O separate until you use them.

As simple water torch has been around for decades. I used to use one on jewelry welding. Produced a nice thin pencil flame easy to control that was 5000 degrees Fahrenheit.  The combing of H and O leaves WATER as an 'exhaust' but that evaporates in the heat of the flame so is not an issue

A simple electrolysis water torch can be bought or make it yourself cheap. A good quality pro modle runs around $1400.00  No need to reinvent the wheeel..

Just add water... a low voltage supply and voila

SRA H20 WELDER #250 (1) TORCH FOR SOLDERING AND BRAZING

(http://sra-solder.com/shopimages/products/normal/sra250.jpg)

QuoteThis unique machine generates a Clean Pin Point Flame With Temperatures Up to 5000 ºF from a Pen Size Torch.   No gas storage for safe, simple, reliable brazing and soldering.
This unit is supplied with 1 torch.
The Torch Stand is optional.
In operation the SRA H20 Welders uses low voltage electricity to dissociate distilled water into hydrogen and oxygen gases.
The torch tip is a hypodermic needle with 5 different sizes available.
Boric acid can be added to the Methyl-alcohol to act as a gas flux to keep parts clean. Distilled Water and Methyl-alcohol would need to be purchased locally.
Everything else is included.

http://sra-solder.com/product.php/6020/0?gclid=CI2e6PiOv7gCFWxyQgod5UoA2A

Quote from: Eighthman on July 19, 2013, 04:12:30 PM
I believe there is proof - suggested by JPL years ago- that adding H2 to a gasoline fed engine might be synergistic - increasing gas mileage by modulating the speed of the flame front.  Of course,  you can't legally experiment with this idea because Federal law prohibits any modification of pollution devices ( reminds me of "Three Felonies A Day")

Back in my Car Ralley days we used to inject water vapor into the carbs... got extra gas milage that way too... :D

Later we used AvGas  (Aviation fuel for Cesnas) and other alcohol mixtures.

No it wasn't cheaper... just gave you more power :D

Yup you can still get them today :D

(http://www.alcoholinjectionsystems.com/templates/0078/images/warninganimated.gif)

http://www.alcoholinjectionsystems.com/index.html?gclid=CLPqjZOcv7gCFZF7QgodRFIAjw

My Ralley car was a Toyota 1976 Corona (ralley special) Had twin overhead half racing cams and twin solex carburators... Stripped out all the anti pollution stuff was getting 50 MPG at that time normal street driving

Took the car in for inspection because it needed to be road worthy... passed emission tests with flying colors :D

You CAN legally alter emission devices but you have to go get it passed after. It IS possible to have less emissions by modifications :D  All you have to do is take it to a DOT  inspection station and pass.  If your smart enough to tinker with the car, making it pass inspection is not that hard.

Race cars do not have to be street legal but Ralley cars do

I miss that car... sold it when I moved down to the States  Only found out after I got here that I could have brought it in under the Classic Car rules  DAMN  That thing did 185 in 3rd gear and had 5  speed syncromesh transmission...   Red line was somewhere over 9500 rpm  Engine was an 18RG imported 'used' from Japan and then rebuilt  (only way to get it legally :P )

I nearly posted about water injection Z.
yes we use it in todays turbocharged cars to gain more power as well as help stop detonation problems.
So you're a Hot Rodder eh 8) another petrol head cool wait till ElvisH reads this he'll be as chuffed as me.infact take this to his "Top Gear" thread. ;)
RED LINE 9500 WOOOO revy. sure must of been a short stroker.you talk the talk too impressive.

us in the UK just cannot get our heads around the need for the USA to have all these 5 litre + engines that are just gas guzzlers and not even that powerful for there cubic capacity.
The usual response from uncle sam is "COS WE CAN"
Take the early Formula 1 cars when that we're 1400 cc turbocharged v8's 900BHP all that jizz from little more capacity than your carton of orange juice :P

now there what 1600 only small but huge BHP
http://www.autoevolution.com/news/turbocharged-engines-in-formula-one-18108.html (http://www.autoevolution.com/news/turbocharged-engines-in-formula-one-18108.html)

Quote from: Eighthman on July 17, 2013, 09:17:41 PM
I am having great doubt about this HV/Moving Piston Device because of what it would suggest, if real.

If any of us got hold of a free energy device,  we would hold in our hands the ability to upend the whole global financial system, crash the stock markets,  emasculate the Evil Bankers and re-order all of Middle East politics.

I could not resist such temptation - and given that I believe you wish to be a Benefactor of Humanity, I don't see how you could turn down such an opportunity.

Nevertheless, I am not a pathological skeptic and respectfully wish to consider your reply.  I have many years of experience with high voltages applied to deionized water cooling systems - in tetrodes and klystrons ( although that is DC and has no insulation, other than the ion-free water itself)

I can assure you it has been done.

This drawing may be easier to follow ?


(http://www.thelivingmoon.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10003/normal_H2_O2_Generator.jpg)


NOTE; A very thin film of water must be used !


To get more understanding regarding producing plasma's yourself at home see...

http://jnaudin.free.fr/html/s_gdp1.htm

Quote from: stealthyaroura on July 21, 2013, 01:00:24 AM
I nearly posted about water injection Z.
RED LINE 9500 WOOOO revy. sure must of been a short stroker.you talk the talk too impressive.

Toyota 18RG Engine
http://www.obrasmechanicos.com/18rg.html

18RG - dohc, 9.7:1 compression ratio, Toyota cylinder head, no smog hardware and 140 hp. Very rare and desirable. 4 cylinder 2litre 

Toyota 2000GT

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/97/TOYOTA_2000GT.jpg/800px-TOYOTA_2000GT.jpg)

Twin Solex Carbs  basiclly one throat per cylinder :D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B1Ou1yA155g

Toyota Corona SR5 1974-76  Had an instrument panel on the ceiling with navigator lights like an airplane... reinforce side panels built in stone guard on bottom and reinforce struts

(http://farm1.static.flickr.com/190/448675258_0eb669cde8.jpg)

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/97/TOYOTA_2000GT.jpg/800px-TOYOTA_2000GT.jpg)
yes ZORG i'm a time served mechanic i can crunch them numbers. 8)
you do realize how much a mint one of those is worth now :o
it's the car from 007 well they made the convertible JUST for that and liked it.
http://www.motorauthority.com/news/1084152_james-bond-style-1967-toyota-2000-gt-sells-for-1-15-million (http://www.motorauthority.com/news/1084152_james-bond-style-1967-toyota-2000-gt-sells-for-1-15-million)

(http://farm1.static.flickr.com/190/448675258_0eb669cde8.jpg)
THAT is a classic love them jap engines. there very good.still are.
I bet you still had that beast. 8) that's some horses a little tweak here and there they all add the BHP. silly kids with their noisy exhaust sigh ::) it's all about gasflow,porting nice 4 branch thermally shielded manifolds etc. BUT of course you know all this Z. Ahh car porn.

Jap engineering IS good :D

I drove a 2 liter Celica GT up a mountain in France once, felt like i was in 'the italian job' LOL

I guess this is where i go 'cough cough Stan Meyer (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stan_Meyer)'

Quote from: PlaysWithMachines on July 21, 2013, 11:50:48 AM
I drove a 2 liter Celica GT up a mountain in France once, felt like i was in 'the italian job' LOL

Celica and Corona had the same engine, but the Corona was more durable off road :D

If I get good cash for my stamp collection I may see if I can find one :D

Quote from: PlaysWithMachines on July 21, 2013, 11:50:48 AM
Jap engineering IS good :D

I drove a 2 liter Celica GT up a mountain in France once, felt like i was in 'the italian job' LOL

I guess this is where i go 'cough cough Stan Meyer (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stan_Meyer)'

yep meyer land pal. i'm liking matrix T design and I reckon the plates method is the best for producing loads of HHO on demand and a small 1000cc engine.
just need you luke pal to come up with the signal for the circuit to break them atoms free the most effectively.
oh and the circuit. ;D
you have the frequency counters voltage regulators and oscilloscopes mate.
I have seen the setup I would like but it's dear stuff (the equipment) i'm not so sure of the terms as i'm a bit rusty but if I show you a vid of a guys gear maybe you can give a quick explanation of what it is and what it does.no rush I know ya busy pal. just check back once in awhile. ROB.

Quote from: stealthyaroura on July 21, 2013, 07:41:22 AM
silly kids with their noisy exhaust sigh ::)

Yeah the silly kids always wanted to prove something... :P Problem is I could hit 55mph before needing to change to second :P

This is similar to what the interior looked like though I didn't strip my upholstery

(http://i277.photobucket.com/albums/kk58/robertkassner/CIMG0953.jpg)

thats the way Z strip out all the excess weight.
makes NO difference to the top end but the acceleration!
thats a different story.meant to say bet you WISH you still had that jap ROD.
is there anything you have not done :P
I bet under the hood was as immaculate as the exterior?
was that your motor the corona on the drive? very clean example.$$$$$

real mans man. petrol head ;)
maybe we should move the petrol headness over to Elvis H's thread Top Gear?
or too much work? i don't mind either way.

The only thing i can do is move the entire 'Stan Meyer verified' thread from the Inventor's Forum to here.
Give me a day or 2.....kinda busy ::)

Quote from: PlaysWithMachines on July 21, 2013, 12:32:11 PM
The only thing i can do is move the entire 'Stan Meyer verified' thread from the Inventor's Forum to here.
Give me a day or 2.....kinda busy ::)

NO NO leave it there I am a member pal. don't stress.
honest. I will pop in there (should be in there more shame on me!!!)

pwm,(glad to see you,mate 8)) stealthy, I have a design for hho courtesy of matyas that doesn't use plates; which it does produce hydrogen peroxide but all it is consists of a plastic container(grounded, of course) of water with a spark plug wire from a coilpack inserted in it then tied into the engine timing so you get pulsed hv every time the engine fires...

supposed to work on any type of water without added catalyst...


thoughts?


seeker

sounds simple enough seeker yes just tap straight into the ignition coil :D
heck take a tap off each HT lead even the RPM would regulate the HH0 output :D
can't see there being a problem as far as upsetting the firing of the engine if diodes
are used so there's no feedback.

i'm thinking a small car like a 1000cc 4 cylinder with a carburetor.
none of this injection or ECU stuff or the myriad of sensors.
Keep it simple I say. sounds good seeker, promising.

Glad to be back, even if it's short sessions, i'm kind of overloaded with work right now ;D

OK i'll leave it there for now, but you know i'm planning a 'pegileaks' campaign to give members some real meat so to speak, heck this info is all open sourced.

Only i was with the original group that succeeded in running cars on water.

Twice.

So I.F. members, please read the entire thread, it's way back in the list because it was one of the first threads i ever posted here.

(Please tell me the links still work or not, so i can fix them)

Without spilling too many details, we tried both a high-tech & a low-tech approach.

The low tech was jam jars & stainless plates, it worked to some degreee but there are far better deigns already on YT, one got posted in our forum if i remember...

The high tech approach was literally an exact copy of Mayer's multi-pipe fuel cell.

It works a treat, ant that guy is already selling parts for DIY conversions.
Seems he's too busy to accept my invite to join us here :( but i can still contact him for tech info, no problem 8)

The latest one is even more efficient than the Meyer design, and simpler to build, it's the one made from a stack of (stainless?) bowls stacked up like, well, a stack of plates on the table. :D

Seeker, i would like to see info onthat, but it would work well i guess.

Electrolysis works by high voltage pulses, and resonance.

This breaks the H-O bonds using very little energy.

Meyer also used other tricks including something called 'laser conditioning' of the H-O-H condensate just before it went into the engine.

I have seen (like those posted by Z etc) HHo torches, even seen an HHO barbecue on YooToob.

So anyone still saying it doesnt work because of that flawed logic of putting the same energy in to split the water, have completely lost that one :P

If you can split water using less than 100 watts to power a 100 HP engine, that means there is definitely about 7000% efficiency going on.

Confused? You should be, so are we, but it works nonetheless :P

Matrix told me about many other uses for water, it's really amazing stuff that we take for granted, but it seems like water is actually the powerhouse of the universe.

This was so promising I'm sure I will get "schooled" yet again about the current progress in this field.
the nuclear battery.This would be the perfect device to power the circuit IF we're going with HH0 production to run an internal combustion engine.Take away the alternator so there is no load on the engine. power ALL the other electrics ie lights ,rad fan,cigar lighter ;D
Or do we just go totally electric and forget about the internal combustion engine for transport?
http://www.scienceagogo.com/message_board3/messages/1350.shtml (http://www.scienceagogo.com/message_board3/messages/1350.shtml)

Bloody dangerous business this free energy lark. if TPTB/big oil don't kill you or your family they may certainly ruin your life. >:(
But think of all that nasty toxic waste just waiting to be safely harnessed and used for the good of the planet for a change. ::)

EDIT TO ADD what is PWM intention for the use of the generator he is working on?A power supply to create HHO as fuel for an automobile? or is to get off the grid? both 8) ?

Both.
All of the above, plus a few new ones like a portable fusion reactor ;)

Hopefully i can get back on those projects soon, just to busy right now, need to make some cash for the next projects & get Ron his assistant :P

ETA: the idea was to use HHO as a stopgap measure until the really high tech stuff is up & running.
HHO means you can run all existing engines. Boats, planes, cars, generators etc.

Dont know about a HHO jet, but the piston engine types could run on water...

GREAT IDEA PWM my thoughts exactly.convert existing technology as 99% of the hardware
is there and proven.I know the money thing it's a bloody nightmare for a lot of us here in the UK.

PWM
Glad to see you are alive and well. There has been a big shake up in the Dollard camp as well as a few other alternate energy places. Had me worried that it was happening here. Hope we can talk soon.

Sorry Z for the rant.
Bless
Back

A few years ago I pulled a box from a skip with a plug on it.It was a piezo electric humidifyer.
you can guess where i'm going with this :P

yep I often wondered what if I put petrol on that disk? can I place some kind of setup in a manifold?
well I had a clear out and chucked it :( bad move looking back, but a quick look on tube and there are some vids of works in progress but some look overly complicated.so the theory is sound.

I bet there may even be a commercial version? there should be by my reckoning it just makes sense. even the output of the "fog" could be throttled as there were control knobs on my humidifier for this.

surely this could be a way to improve fuel efficiency? I have even seen the odd fuel and water combo being run and it should work. 8)
have any of you guys done research into this method of fuel delivery?

Having spent many years (Professionally) in engine design I can say that the fuel
is the heat source in an internal combustion engine, whether in your car or a turbine engine.

Its NOT the burning fuel which either pushes that piston down
in your cars engine or rotates the blades in a gas turbine engine, but instead
it is the expanding Nitrogen which can't burn easily, that pushes
the piston down or rotates the blades in a gas turbine engine..

So the efficiency of an internal combustion engine (including gas turbines) is reliant
on the "Thermal efficiency" of the engine.

The first problem arises in that the ratio of oxygen to nitrogen (in our air) is not 100%
suitable for an internal combustion engine. In fact there is too much oxygen in the airs ratio.

The Earths atmosphere has about 78% Nitrogen and about 21% oxygen.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atmosphere_of_Earth


The Oxygen is the one of interest, and for the most desirable Combustion, about 15% oxygen
is most desirable, (affecting Thermodynamics in the engine) but what upsets things is that,
the fuel requires a different mixture of oxygen & fuel suitable to maintain stoichiometric mixture.

Note the Nitrogen is NOT strictly involved in the Combustion process even some nitrogen oxides
are often found in exhaust gas's. The Nitrogen is the component which expands being heated by
the Oxidisation (burning) fuel.



So what is happening in an internal combustion engine, is that too much energy is generated
for the amount of Nitrogen, and as a result "Thermal Mass" is increased in the engine block.

If we choose another fuel, other than petrol, then the above scenario changes accordingly.

i.e. alternative fuels esp. when designing engines in the high performance (Competitive) industry.

This is why we use different fuels in Racing, as it takes into account the stoichiometric ratios
as well as ratios (oxygen to Nitrogen) affecting the Thermal Mass in the engine.

http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/thermo/carnot.html

http://web.mit.edu/16.unified/www/SPRING/propulsion/notes/node23.html



By using EGR, ("Exhaust Gas Recycling") displacing a little of the air intake, changes the ratio
of nitrogen to oxygen which can increase power out put between 10% to 15%.
As a result fuel consumption is improved and a little increase in power.
Ideally this needs to be computer controlled.

Note; EGR is Not only used to affect exhaust gas's for environmental reasons.


"Thermal efficiency" can also be dramatically improved, by reducing the "Thermal mass" present
in the engines components.

The main problem involves the transfer of energy back to the engine block from the exhaust manifold.

This can be overcome by insulating the exhaust manifold from the engine block.

But if we do this attention must be given to Piston materials and piston to cylinder wall clearances.

If design features are not changed then you run the risk of seizure.


The additional power received from water injection is around the fact that water can not
be compressed so the compression pressure rises.

And secondly water expands somewhat, when heated to high temperatures.
Especially if "Supper heated steam" is produced. (Very High Expansion)

So regarding water injection it is desirable to preheat the water first.
Coil the water supply piping around the exhaust manifold and then inject a fine spray
into the intake as close as possible to the intake valves.

The down fall though, is "Water injection" increases thermal mass but this can be reduced
by thermally isolating the exhaust manifold from the engine block.

Remember "piston clearances" should be increased accordingly, or use different piston alloys.

Quote from: The Matrix Traveller on July 22, 2013, 02:28:01 AM
Having spent many years (Professionally) in engine design I can say that the fuel
is the heat source in an internal combustion engine, whether in your car or a turbine engine.

Its NOT the burning fuel which either pushes that piston down
in your cars engine or rotates the blades in a gas turbine engine, but instead
it is the expanding Nitrogen which can't burn easily, that pushes
the piston down or rotates the blades in a gas turbine engine..

So the efficiency of an internal combustion engine (including gas turbines) is reliant
on the "Thermal efficiency" of the engine.

The first problem arises in that the ratio of oxygen to nitrogen (in our air) is not 100%
suitable for an internal combustion engine. In fact there is too much oxygen in the airs ratio.

The Earths atmosphere has about 78% Nitrogen and about 21% oxygen.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atmosphere_of_Earth


The Oxygen is the one of interest, and for the most desirable Combustion, about 15% oxygen
is most desirable, (affecting Thermodynamics in the engine) but what upsets things is that,
the fuel requires a different mixture of oxygen & fuel suitable to maintain stoichiometric mixture.

Note the Nitrogen is NOT strictly involved in the Combustion process even some nitrogen oxides
are often found in exhaust gas's. The Nitrogen is the component which expands being heated by
the Oxidisation (burning) fuel.



So what is happening in an internal combustion engine, is that too much energy is generated
for the amount of Nitrogen, and as a result "Thermal Mass" is increased in the engine block.

If we choose another fuel, other than petrol, then the above scenario changes accordingly.

i.e. alternative fuels esp. when designing engines in the high performance (Competitive) industry.

This is why we use different fuels in Racing, as it takes into account the stoichiometric ratios
as well as ratios (oxygen to Nitrogen) affecting the Thermal Mass in the engine.

http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/thermo/carnot.html

http://web.mit.edu/16.unified/www/SPRING/propulsion/notes/node23.html



By using EGR, ("Exhaust Gas Recycling") displacing a little of the air intake, changes the ratio
of nitrogen to oxygen which can increase power out put between 10% to 15%.
As a result fuel consumption is improved and a little increase in power.
Ideally this needs to be computer controlled.

Note; EGR is Not only used to affect exhaust gas's for environmental reasons.

-------------------------------

"Thermal efficiency" can also be dramatically improved, by reducing the "Thermal mass" present
in the engines components.

The main problem involves the transfer of energy back to the engine block from the exhaust manifold.

This can be overcome by insulating the exhaust manifold from the engine block.

But if we do this attention must be given to Piston materials and piston to cylinder wall clearances.

If design features are not changed then you run the risk of seizure.

--------------------------------------

The additional power received from water injection is around the fact that water can not
be compressed so the compression pressure rises.

And secondly water expands somewhat, when heated to high temperatures.
Especially if "Supper heated steam" is produced. (Very High Expansion)

So regarding water injection it is desirable to preheat the water first.
Coil the water supply piping around the exhaust manifold and then inject a fine spray
into the intake as close as possible to the intake valves.

The down fall though, is "Water injection" increases thermal mass but this can be reduced
by thermally isolating the exhaust manifold from the engine block.

Remember "piston clearances" should be increased accordingly, or use different piston alloys.

yep could not of put it better myself.
this is why the fancy branch exhaust manifolds are thermally wrapped. same goes for water injection increases the compression ratio and helps solve detonation issues.
Nitrous oxide we can add this too into the mix, NO it is not incredibly flammable (a common misconception) it creates more oxygen and nitrogen as well as cooling air making it more dense allowing more of the mixture to be drawn into the combustion chamber.

nice post matrix T another petrol head ;)

The "Thermal insulation" I was referring to, replaces the exhaust manifold 'Gasket',
Along with thermal isolation from the mounting 'studs'.

"Exhaust wrap" often used, is used for much different reasons though.

1.    Lower the energy contained in the engine compartment.
and
2.    Gas's flow much easier at higher temperatures.

But the "Thermal insulation" I was referring to.... was to isolate the exhaust manifold
from the engine block, to prevent energy building up in the manifold, flowing back
into the Engine block itself, where we don't want it !

Thus reducing the "Thermal Mass", in the Engine block itself.

This allows the intake temperature (in the Cylinder) to become much lower,
which means on the intake and compression strokes, the air and fuel
in the cylinder are at a much lower temperature.
This enables a much denser intake of air.    :)


NOTE;   While the intake cycle is taking place, energy from the engine block
flows into the air fuel mixture causing the mixture to expand, and so reduces the density
and quantity by weight left in the cylinder when the intake valve closes.

So by reducing the engines "Thermal Mass", has a profound affect on the density
of the air fuel mixture, at the point the intake valve closes.

Regarding a water type engine This engine described below is essentially a Low RPM High torque engine.

There is only one intelligent setup and that is a closed loop engine.

By being "Closed loop" I mean the water is changed between two states without any exhaust !

1.  Its liquid form
and
2.  Its Gaseous state, NOT steam but H2O2 

(This I have known about for some years now.)

Basically it involves a cylinder and piston.
A Ceramic cylinder is encapsulated in an outer metal cylinder, (Metal outer is for Strength)
or can be a Steel Cylinder coated internally with Ceramic (of the electrically isolative type)
with one end closed.

The closed end of the Cylinder, must also be coated in the same ceramic.

At the open end of the cylinder, install a thin wall bush and a Stainless Steel piston. (solid Rod)
So when the Piston (Solid Rod) is fully inserted, the gap between the Piston and the Cylinder wall
is no more than 0.1 mm.

The opposite end of the piston's stroke, insert an electrode isolated from the metal cylinder.
(to serve as a "Spark plug".)

Now charge the cylinder with steam, in a low pressure environment, and partially insert the cylinder
using some pressure applied to the piston.

Allow the steam to cool and condense in the cylinder, so the piston is drawn inside the cylinder,
to nearly contact the closed end. Some small clearance is required though.

A suitable double back to back seal should be used at the open end of the cylinder.

The Piston (A solid Round bar) is attached by a con. rod to a Crank.


To run the device.

Connect the Piston and outer steel casing to a VHV oscillating source (ignition coil) momentarily.
(a few milliseconds)

So between the piston and cylinder forms a HV capacitance.

The thin film of water (forming part of the dielectric) will be rapidly converted to H2O2
and the piston will be pushed toward the open end of the cylinder.

When the piston reaches the end of its stroke, then ignite the H2 & O2 by the spark plug.

The H2 is now oxidised by the O2, (Burnt) and the water reverts back to its liquid state,
and the piston is drawn (Sucked) back into the cylinder.

So you see we have a "2 stroke engine" working on a closed loop principal,
changing H2O between its two states.

No exhaust = NO pollution.


The only source of power required, is electric which can be achieved by using a "piezo-ignite" !

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piezo_ignition

This can both supply the power at the spark plug, as well as the small current, required to convert
the state of water from a liquid to a gas. (H2O2)

But use an induction coil to obtain the oscillations required. This will require a little tuning.

The capacitance method of obtaining H2O2 is far, far, more efficient, than the "current method"
of conversion used today.

The capacitive method does NOT require a Catalyst.

The change is made by the Plasma occurring between the piston and cylinder wall,
where the capacitive action takes place.

So the water and ceramic are both components of the dielectric.

See my previous post on converting water to H2O2...

Quote from: stealthyaroura on July 21, 2013, 12:29:10 PM
maybe we should move the petrol headness over to Elvis H's thread Top Gear?
or too much work? i don't mind either way.

Yeah was thinking the same :D  Will do tomorrow

Gary Stenzel
Water Decomposition by AC Electrolysis
Letter Dated Aug 13, 2006

The file Andrija Puharich: Water Decomposition by AC Electrolysis (http://www.thelivingmoon.com/41pegasus/32garys_files/Water_Decomposition/1puhar.htm) explains most of my project. I'm pretty busy, and I don't have much extra time to work on this at all. That's why it's going pretty slowly at the present time.

The 2 pics "inside" and "outside" are of my modified reaction chamber. Basically, all it is is a PVC tank with a screw-off lid. Inside is mounted a 2" piece of copper pipe, inside that is a 1" copper pipe. If it all works as planned they will be changed out with stainless steel.

One wire is soldered to each copper pipe and the solder connection is sealed off with silicone. The two wires will come out near the top of the tank and be siliconed  inside and out to try to make the container air-tight.

I also included scans of my 3 circuits. There is a 600hz audio oscillator, a 62985hz oscillator for the carrier frequency, and an amplitude modulator to connect it all together.

If you have any questions, you can email me at venus fly trap@att.net.

- Gary

(http://www.thelivingmoon.com/41pegasus/32garys_files/Water_Decomposition/AM_Modulator.jpg)
AM Modulator

(http://www.thelivingmoon.com/41pegasus/32garys_files/Water_Decomposition/AudioOscillator.jpg)
Audio Oscillator

(http://www.thelivingmoon.com/41pegasus/32garys_files/Water_Decomposition/CarrierOscillator.jpg)
Carrier Oscillator

(http://www.thelivingmoon.com/41pegasus/32garys_files/Water_Decomposition/Inside_sm.JPG)
Inside View

(http://www.thelivingmoon.com/41pegasus/32garys_files/Water_Decomposition/Outside_sm.JPG)
Outside View

All Images and Text on this page  © 2006 by Gary Stenzel
Printed by Permission
http://www.thelivingmoon.com/41pegasus/32garys_files/Gary001.html

Andrija Puharich: Water Decomposition by AC Electrolysis

QuoteDr Andrija Puharich reportedly drove his motor home for hundreds of thousands of miles around North America in the 1970s using only water as fuel. At a mountain pass in Mexico, he collected snow for water. Here is the only article he wrote on the subject, plus his patent:

Andrija Puharich: Water Decomposition by AC Electrolysis (http://www.thelivingmoon.com/41pegasus/32garys_files/Water_Decomposition/1puhar.htm)

Cutting The Gordian Knot of the Great Energy Bind  (http://www.thelivingmoon.com/41pegasus/32garys_files/Water_Decomposition/1puhar.htm)
by Andrija Puharich

US Patent # 4,394,230
Method & Apparatus for Splitting Water Molecules (http://www.thelivingmoon.com/41pegasus/32garys_files/Water_Decomposition/1puhar.htm#4394230)
Henry K. Puharich
(July 19, 1983)

That's a very neat system Matrix, and of course you are dead right about infernal combustion. A great post 8)
I would love to have a go at a closed loop system.
Bit like a Sterling engine :)

Our man who did the low-tech system had a bootfull of jam-jars & it drew 12 amps, and it didn't produce enough to run the engine, but it improved his milege by 30%.

The stan meyer system reports 100% running on water, but i havent seen it myself. The guy is actually a member here but he has never posted....
I have seen his video's and we used to chat daily, i know he's busy designing & selling kits for DIY conversions.

We had an interesting problem with the low tech system, the MAP sensor.
It didn't like HHO and it kept trying to compensate by changing the fuel ratio.
So we had to fool it into thinking the engine had enough oxygen & didn't need any more fuel :P