My stance on guns

[ArMaP]

I bet if I asked any One of You if You believed in freedom You would say, "Oh, sure,"  But many here seem to think the solution to life as risk is to strip freedoms away from People.

Yes, I do believe in freedom, and I do believe that freedom doesn't mean that anyone can do whatever they want, and that with freedom comes responsibility, and that those that want to live in a society should be responsible for not infringing in other people's freedom.

The fact is that life IS a risk, and One cannot make Us safe by taking away freedoms.  All it does is drive Us closer and ever closer to fascism.  And decidedly NOT free.

Sure, life is risk, after all, all people that have died started out by being alive. 
But yes, people can become safer when some of their freedoms are taken away. If you take away someone's freedom of movement by holding them in closed room you made his/her life safer, as now it's harder (or even impossible) for that person to, for example, be hit by a car.
As for freedoms, what about loitering laws? And what about drinking in public places?

[PLAYSWITHMACHINES]

and that with freedom comes responsibility

Precisely!
If we can all agree to be responsible for our actions, and responsible for all life, not just your own, but your neighbour, or that stranger, or that dog, or even just a houseplant.

Be aware of life, nurture it, then we will be free.

I would think that the ONLY reason you would lock someone in a closed room was if they were a real danger to others. And even then those would quickly diminish, as society becomes more stable & people adjust mentally to it.

As for freedoms, what about loitering laws? And what about drinking in public places?

We have public drinking places, they are called 'pubs' or 'bars' depending on where you live
These places should be open 24/7 it would sure ease congestion

[Ellirium113]

There is no such thing as "responsible freedom". Either you are FREE or you are held accountable to obey a certain set of rules, either self manifested, or bestowed upon you by a government or some higher authority (dieties). You either want controls put in place to hinder behavior deemed unacceptable or you do not.  We do have the freedom of choice to either follow these guidelines or face the consequences of our actions.

[PLAYSWITHMACHINES]

We do have the freedom of choice to either follow these guidelines or face the consequences of our actions.

In a sense, you are right.
Truly free means also being free to kil & maim, but that's a kind of social no-no isn't it?. Thou Shalt Not Kill is taught in every religion, although not many respect that part of it.
So yes, we humans are bound by social restrictions placed there to protect us from ourselves, but within those (very sensible) restrictions we can do what we like.
Sometimes i just don't see what all the fuss is about......

[Ellirium113]

In a sense, you are right.
Truly free means also being free to kil & maim, but that's a kind of social no-no isn't it?. Thou Shalt Not Kill is taught in every religion, although not many respect that part of it.
So yes, we humans are bound by social restrictions placed there to protect us from ourselves, but within those (very sensible) restrictions we can do what we like.
Sometimes i just don't see what all the fuss is about......

Indeed...we are taught at a young age that all life is precious, so why do we cheapen our lives by allowing weapons to destroy lives en-masse to fall into the hands of the general public? The more tools we are allowed to have to destroy lives the more rules must be put into place to protect people from those incapable of making moral decisions. One problem with this is that now there are far too many people to enforce any such laws effectively. Why is it ok to be allowed to have all manner of firearms including machine guns but yet you can not make a bomb? Your enemy might have a bomb and all you have is a gun...what now? It seems to me that society is having a hard time getting along, so we impose our will at gunpoint. Even viruses get along with each other better than humans do.

[Shasta56]

Let's have a worldwide ban on assault weapons.  None for civilians or military.  Let the military go back to fighting with much lower tech weaponry.  Knives, swords, spears, rocks, fists.  I'm quite certain my ancestors, in their various clan wars, were able to inflict plenty of damage on each other withought assault weapons.  At some point they managed to start getting along and getting married.  The further back I go in my ancestry research, the more clans I find that I'm related to.  At some point, they got tired of having to clean up the mess after they'd killed each other.

I support gun ownership for hunting and self defense.  My revolver can fire six shots, each requiring a conscious effort.  If it's empty I can throw it.  I don't need the ability to mow my crabby neighbor down.

Shasta

[robomont]

those that give up liberty for freedom or safety deserve none.

[Amaterasu]

Exactly, robo. 

Believe Me, Petrus, I would be boiling mad if I didn't choose to pour that energy into a solution to the very problem We have:  the central bankers and Their usury.

[petrus4]

[Amaterasu]

Nice piece, Petrus!

He speaks the truth.  Hopefully We will wake up fast enough such that They don't bring Us to Our knees.

[petrus4]

http://blog.beliefnet.com/on_the_front_lines_of_the_culture_wars/2011/04/she-survived-hitler-and-wants-to-warn-america.html#ixzz2Fzr5YTU1

[Amaterasu]

Thought this should be here in this thread:

[spacemaverick]

This one is an hour long but I liked it.

[rdunk]

The framers of the Constitution of the United States knew exactly what they were doing, and why. it is quite sad that so many in this country have an opinion about guns, but actually have not a clue about the facts about which they speak. And the media is completely grossed out with such who are quick to jump into gun control, with clueless actual knowledge.

We should look to our history, and to the history of other nations, to the relevance of the people being adequately armed, to the actions of governments.

For instance, here is a quote on the subject, by one of the most well known persons of this earth - - -

""Among the many misdeeds of the British rule in India, history will look upon the Act depriving a whole nation of arms, as the blackest." -- Mahatma Gandhi (An Autobiography OR The story of my experiments with truth, by M.K. Gandhi, p.238)

And here is a link to a detailed commentary that contains that quote, which describes India's history in the mud and quicksand of this subject.

http://www.abhijeetsingh.com/arms/india/

This is a worthwhile read, and it does let us see into how a country's governing stance on guns has affected the lives of the people, in very negative ways. I am sure that if we were to look, we could find numerous other such similar examples of how "gun controls" by governments have deleteriously impacted the lives of citizens.

One of my biggest concerns is that the angst of another terrible tragedy will be the the very basis for "not letting another crisis go to waste", in dealing with guns, and the 2nd Amendment.

[Amaterasu]

rdunk... History is made, I suspect.  It seems We may actually agree on something! [grin] [wink]