The Extraterrestrial Hypothesis: Pure misdirection?

[Anthra]

I'm happy to disagree about what constitutes credible evidence.  There is no point endlessly debating that.  Basically I require different types of evidence to what you do.  I'll allow the readers to decide which one is likely to make UFOlogy more credible or get the answers to the riddle.

I think its more like we view the Universe in different ways. The kinds of "evidence" you require are very different than what I require.

Your view is akin to a Relativistic view, in such a view you can have discrete events and data to inspect and place on a static "puzzle" until you have enough that you are "comfortable" with your guess.

Mine is a bit more Quantum; in that I view virtually everything a discrete object radiating "probability waves". My view is not static like your, but dynamic, always in a state of change.

When I look for "proof" it is in the form of probabilities as close to 1 as can be found; while knowing that 1 and 0 are not possible (one of the few things that are actually impossible).

That is my business [telepathy].  I just hope you aren't mistaking me for someone who doesn't know something about it.

The upshot is that telepathic, channelled or similar communications are not evidence of where the communication originates or evidence of where the communicator originates from.  Pretend not to understand that obvious fact if you like.  Taking note of the intelligence level of the majority of our members, I expect that it is obvious to most that I am correct on this point - even if they disagree with me on others.

Channelled info is not evidence that the alien experience is ET.  It is simply evidence that information can be received or produced using that method.

I thought you knew about telepathy! It has been my experience that I "know" who I'm talking to, via the telepathic contact.  I may not know the special location of who I'm talking to, unless they actually tell me, but I can tell if they are telling the truth, what species they are, and with little effort I can determine their home star. All this has something to do with the "mind-to-mind" connection and data transfers.

And, of course you are absolutely correct about channeling and any other similar forms of "communication"

I wasn't accusing you of a particular number but generally criticising people who write such nonsense.   Similarly, writing about 10.5 ET races, politics, traits and their homes without credible evidence makes real UFOlogists look like idiots.  I stand by that.

How about we simply not go there; you prolly wouldn't like my opinion on UFOlogists, real or not.

And, I can make those statements, in as much as I have talked to people from those various worlds.  If you have doubts...you're a telepath, yes?

[stealthyaroura]

Some food for thought, I'm sure ZORGON won't mind me borrowing this quote,after all it's just a 'what if' scenario

But engineering it is so tough. So you build your first crude test craft down the road from Los Alamos, and try your inertia lowering theory out again, this time intentionally - surely we've fixed the bugs this time, what a second wonderful contribution to the security of the nation! and bammo, crash landing, all dead out near Roswell. What's the very best coverup? Not denial, that's for sure - we'll pretend it was aliens, and sprinkle some crap around for people to find! General Ramey, for that idea we'll name a base after you! What acting, posing for photos with a UFO coverup order in your hand! Who could believe a general would even have something like outside a secure area, much less held like a product insert in a movie where it can be read! And that'll cover up the other tests later, too. If anyone gets too close, bam! some drugs and hypnosis, and they'll babble about nordics from rigel. No one would believe them! Crazy, right?

[zorgon]

Almost 40 years ago.... I watched a debate on the Pierre Burton show between a lady 'Archaeologist' and Erik von Danekin...

He was calm. presented his evidence but did not claim it as truth, saying it was up to the viewer to make up their own mind..

The  lady 'Archaeologist' on the other hand resorted to the age old tool of skeptics... if you can't prove them wrong, attack their character, yell and stomp your feet, and hope no one calls you on it...

Well in the end Pierre said "While I don't agree with your conclusions, I declare you winner of this debate because you stuck to your guns and remained calm" (paraphrased)

That was when I started looking at Ancient Aliens


Now today. 65 years after Roswell, we still have no Alien corpse, we have no photo of ONE alien that can be independently verified and we have not ONE piece of a crashed saucer despite the HUNDREDS that have supposedly crashed.

We have a myriad of UFO and Alien Hunters out there combing the desert, making symposiums and telling stories... yet still not even ONE verifiable nut or bolt from a crashed saucer

We have a myriad of UFO sightings, Alien abduction stories, etc etc

Then we see the recent shutdown of the Government over a petty squabble over the budget, we see Snowden spill the beans on the NSA spying  and we are to believe that this government and all world governments have manages to keep this under wraps all these years?


We at Pegasus are one of the few groups that have MANY contacts 'in the field'  Joe Resnick and Jack Arneson have both given me accounts of Alien encounters. I have been privy to many military secrets and leads  and just as many good stories...

But in the end... even we have nothing HARD CORE that can be considered PROOF  (not counting the footage of A51 and Bob But that is only proof to us, not something you can lay on CNN that all will believe)


So..

SOMETHING is not right...

I have been seeking for over 40 years... I am running out of time. What I see happening on the UFO circuit is the old timers are slowly dying off, or going for the money. There have been no new whistle blowers

Guys like Nick Pope IMO have turned out to be stooges... I talked to him, heard him at that speech in Vegas... he is not a believer

Will I give up? No because the stories I get are still fascinating and on the Military front, I have been able to say many times "We told you so years ago"

But still  not ONE ALIEN yet

[The Seeker]

It just doesn't add up or make sense, Z; too many of us have been digging for far too long to always come up empty handed... perhaps they are using some form of mind control to keep us from seeing the obvious...

we are getting old, my friend, just as John Lear and Bob are...

I agree, something is not right...


seeker

[sky otter]

maybe it boils down to what we think should be evidence for show and tell

maybe the only person we need to prove anything too is ourself


with the things that i have experienced so far  i KNOW there is MORE
can i prove it to anyone else...
no
but only others who have experienced something on their own are willing to even listen
maybe that's the key

who did you tell?..were they full of fear and laughed to cover?

the movies and tv shows about magic and vamps and things are slowly moving the consciouness into accepting what is really here/there
unfortunately they are also instilling fear

sigh

[Amaterasu]

Oh, I assure You, the fear is instilled with purpose.

[Pimander]

If you have doubts...you're a telepath, yes?

Sometimes there is no need for words.

[Pimander]

Now today. 65 years after Roswell, we still have no Alien corpse, we have no photo of ONE alien that can be independently verified and we have not ONE piece of a crashed saucer despite the HUNDREDS that have supposedly crashed.

Most of those are cover ups of military accidents.  That is so blatantly obvious.

Crash, esp involving nuclear material.  Procedure:

If it is spotted by public make some exaggerated reports to UFO groups to confuse and make investigators and witnesses not look credible.

If personnel who cannot be trusted are involved or might talk: Drug them, pretend to be the NSA, and, using drugs, debrief with scare tactics and make them think there are aliens so if they do talk their story is incredible or unbelievable (e.g. Rendlesham Forest).

Bob Lazar was allegedly drugged too and then reportedly saw a "grey".

At all costs insist that the ET hypothesis or it not happening at all are the only matters focused on.

But still  not ONE ALIEN yet

Perhaps.

Psychotronic weapons?  I think they have been tested at nuclear sites which has helped to muddy the waters.

There is something else too but I am keeping it close to my chest for fear that clues will dry up.

[rose]

the movies and tv shows about magic and vamps and things are slowly moving the consciouness into accepting what is really here/there
unfortunately they are also instilling fear

And the show, "Person of Interest"  is instilling the idea that protection comes from being watched constantly.

We went on vacation with our 20-somethings children recently and I was amazed at how constantly connected they were. In the end that has to be a good thing, but is the price worth it? 

Sorry for the thread drift.

Back to the topic at hand.  Seems like we have hold of two ends to the issue.  End One is the one where we all end up...believing what we experience outwardly and innerly.  Magical things happen and we know them to be true.

End Two is...to discover if is there a 'technologica'l secret that hasn't yet been uncovered. Taking it as a given that psychotronic weapons exist and that there have been downed US craft, is there something else in use that has not yet been ventured?

rose

[Anthra]

Hill's map

Sorry to say it, but the above sketch is not credible evidence that "The Greys" are actual extraterrestrials from Zeta Reticuli.  I won't get deeply into a debate about whether that sketch is credible evidence based on the Fish interpretation.  Why?

It is a view from a point in space (not here).  It could easily be obtained in a "dream" by a technique widely known on this site.  Remote viewing.

Okay, here is something to compare with in regards the Hill map. I've constructed a 3D model of the Hill Map, using the best guess interpretations that are available.



It seems that 2/3 of the stars match rather easily. Gliese 59.1, Tau(1) Eridani and Ka Fornacis seem to be on their own plane and rotated 90 degrees. Gliese 67 is probably a misidentification as it is completely misplaced. So, 1 star out of 13 misplaced...a virtual 97% accurate.

This view is from around 70 light years in the direction of Gliese 59.1

The star positional data is from a flavor of the ISBN star catalog, imported into SQL server. I wrote a short application to get star data from the database, and compute X, Y, Z coordinates. The source is available.

Most of the stars are "G" class, some are "F" class. All are at least 3 billion years old, and typically less than 6 billion or so. Making all of these stars prime candidates for life very much like is described in various reports, or found here on Earth.

[karl 12]

Here we go - thought these were some relevant interviews with the late Karl Pflock (sourced by Alfred Roseberg over on RealTVUFOs).

The late Karl T. Pflock, former U.S. Deputy Assistant Secretary
of Defense (Deputy Director) for Operational Test and Evaluation (1985-89), CIA Briefing Officer & UFO Researcher

On the ETH:





On Ufology:

[Sinny]

Most of those are cover ups of military accidents.  That is so blatantly obvious.

Crash, esp involving nuclear material.  Procedure:

If it is spotted by public make some exaggerated reports to UFO groups to confuse and make investigators and witnesses not look credible.

If personnel who cannot be trusted are involved or might talk: Drug them, pretend to be the NSA, and, using drugs, debrief with scare tactics and make them think there are aliens so if they do talk their story is incredible or unbelievable (e.g. Rendlesham Forest).

Bob Lazar was allegedly drugged too and then reportedly saw a "grey".

At all costs insist that the ET hypothesis or it not happening at all are the only matters focused on.
Perhaps.

Psychotronic weapons?  I think they have been tested at nuclear sites which has helped to muddy the waters.

There is something else too but I am keeping it close to my chest for fear that clues will dry up.

I know it's not up your street - but clue's to Psychotronic weapons can be found within The Law of One and Peter Beter Material.

The Russian comospheres are apparently great big flying weapons platforms, in the form of glowing metal sphere's, and account for many UFO sightings.

[Pimander]

is there something else in use that has not yet been ventured?

I think a combination of things explains the entire phenomenon

It seems that 2/3 of the stars match rather easily.

So the map is wrong then?  Don't forget, there are an infinite number of points in the galaxy that can be used to find a match with the Hill "map".

Making all of these stars prime candidates for life very much like is described in various reports, or found here on Earth.

That is interesting but not evidence of one let alone ten and a half races of space aliens being in contact with Earth Humans.

Here we go - thought these were some relevant interviews with the late Karl Pflock

I agree with Pflock especially in the last video.  I don't think he gives deception enough importance.

I know it's not up your street - but clue's to Psychotronic weapons can be found within The Law of One and Peter Beter Material.

I suspect Peter Beter thing is a hoax (started with a prank about a candidate who attached himself to the Wallace presidential campaign), although that does not mean that some of the material might not be true.

[Sinny]

I suspect Peter Beter thing is a hoax (started with a prank about a candidate who attached himself to the Wallace presidential campaign), although that does not mean that some of the material might not be true.

Expand and explain please, what's the hoax?

You implied previously that you didn't even think the man existed. This can be proven quite easily - do I need to spoon feed you the evidence?

Or are you suggesting he did exist, and his work is the hoax?

You can have your own opinion on the latter - that is your choice.

If it is all a hoax, it's not a very good one - it has taken some people great effort to keep his name alive, and he is still relatively unknown.
His information is not to be found on more than 15-20 internet links - nobody apart from myself is 'pushing this information', as a usual hoax would usually entail.

Hey - Maybe I created the hoax! 

[Pimander]

Expand and explain please, what's the hoax?

The material may not really be anything to do with Peter Beter.  In fact are you certain there was a real Dr Peter Beter who has a doctorate from a University in Washington?  I guess it is a side issue if you are convinced by material itself.

Basically, I have never seen concrete evidence that he was a real person except a video saying he was a guy who attached himself to the Wallace Presidential campaign.  The evidence may exist but has anyone checked whether Peter Beter was real as I have not seen it anywhere.

Of course, any material is either true or not so the "Peter Beter" material could still have value even if it wasn't created by a lawyer called Dr Peter Beter.