Is academic science stupid to dismiss UFO reports?

[Elvis Hendrix]

Ha ha Robo got ya 

[ArMaP]

but... but... isn't ArMaP ATS's supreme UFO expert?

Where did you get that idea? 

[ArMaP]

Hey ArMap  you still signing up Fair Skeptics?

That depends.

[undo11]

Where did you get that idea? 

hehe he's teasin' ya.  so am i. and elvis too, i'm pretty sure he doesn't think you look like an old naked guy lol

everyone here loves ya.  just look at all your gold!  i have maybe half of that.  and i've been here since the beginning. :p

hmm, i wonder if it's cause i'm female.  i'm old too, but not naked. that'd be scarier than the 2 old naked guys.  lol

[undo11]

That depends.

on what?  but armap you're so fun to tease.  you usually don't take it seriously.  maybe it went too far.  also consider, elvis probably meant that other guy, not you, anyway. lol

makes ya wonder what that other guy looks like doesn't it?   personally, i see him in my mind's eye as sort of a russian science nazi.   oh i take that back.  he's right quite frequently.  but wrong just enough times to make everyone's adoration of him, rather irritating. 

whereas you've always just been very consistent

- rocks, it's rocks
- sometimes the rock may look odd, but it's probably just a rock
or
- that's strange.

it's the rare "that's strange" that at least convinces you aren't a skeptic just for the sake of being a skeptic.  and folks appreciate that

[PLAYSWITHMACHINES]

in a word, yes.

If it's feasable, then it has probably happened.

Therefore the universe must be teeming with life..

[Elvis Hendrix]

That was phage not Armap. God I always take the piss out of phage and oberg. Armap is my bud and he rules.
I won't be as subtle next time 

[undo11]

That was phage not Armap. God I always take the piss out of phage and oberg. Armap is my bud and he rules.
I won't be as subtle next time 

i like phage better than the o guy.  he was very rude to john and seemed to have a team of hit men that went around with him getting people banned left and right, and just creating general mayhem

[Pimander]

Jaqcues Vallée was wrong, a sceptic doesn't deny any thing.

You can be a sceptic and deny something.  I bet you many deny being a believer.

I don't think he means true sceptics.  For a start Valle is a sceptic.  He means academics who deny or ignore things that are real.

The main denial he refers to is encounters with what appear to be non-conventional craft.  They really happen but they appear to defy rational explanation or defy the laws of physics and academics generally ignore them.  That teaches the public that science is impotent in the face of something it cannot explain - which it is NOT!  Telepathy is a similar class of phenomenon.

My position is that if something happens that you cannot explain then it is scientific to study it sceptically.  It is not scientific to ignore it or deny it  - which is bad science.

[Pimander]

The problem is that most ignore the comparatively few cases for which there are some physical evidences.

Vallee tried to study the physical effects.  I am trying to pick up the baton regarding biological effects but it is not easy.

Apart from radar tapes and film, a lot of the best physical evidence is the effects of UFO encounters on witnesses or plants and animals.  Examples include rashes, loss of memory, consciousness effects (hard to measure and hypnosis IS RARELY USEFUL), traumas and illnesses.....

I see some of evidence of a technology that is real and has effects similar to microwaves but are either combined with something else or possibly have a psychic component.  There are other classes of phenomena that fall under the category of UFOs of course which confuses a lot of "researchers".

I think there is scope for a fresh scientific attack on the UFO "problem".  We have to accept that the mainstream funding is not accessible to study.  That means raising funds or using technology to make it cheap.  A good UFO database would be useful with this in mind.  So would a website where the money did not go to someone like Stephen Greer and was instead used to fund worthwhile science.

[ArMaP]

I think there is scope for a fresh scientific attack on the UFO "problem".  We have to accept that the mainstream funding is not accessible to study.

One famous example is that of the cars stopping, lights and radio off. One thing I have never seen in any of those reports is a simple one: what type of engine did the car have, gasoline or diesel? And has anyone tried to reproduce those effects on a common car or even on a small engine?

A good UFO database would be useful with this in mind.

I think I have seen that word somewhere... 

[Pimander]

One famous example is that of the cars stopping, lights and radio off. One thing I have never seen in any of those reports is a simple one: what type of engine did the car have, gasoline or diesel?

I appears to be the electronics of the cars that are effected.  Think of the Tehran case too.  Electronics on the F16s (or was it Phantoms) went down.

And has anyone tried to reproduce those effects on a common car or even on a small engine?

Yes the military have.  The rumour is that some of the technology they have is capable of shutting down car engines and that it was inspired by studying UFO effects.  It also makes me suspect that some UFO encounters are likely tests of this equipment.  The alien hysteria would make an excellent cover for tests of psychotronic pulsed microwave weapons and non-lethal weapons like ones that deactivate electronics.

Imagine being able to disable tanks, helicopters, missile launchers, radars, nukes.....  Oh yes, UFOs can do all those things.  They all have electronic components.  A weapon which does that is non-lethal and a game changer.

I think I have seen that word somewhere... 

The other day when I was meant to get some time on line, my modem/router was damaged.  I feel like some cosmic force is against me recently!

[rdunk]

I think it interesting that comparatively, our prisons would be much less inhabited, if credible eyewitness accounts were viewed with the same "disdain" as they are in the world of UFO activities. Individual credibility seems to make no difference at the highest levels of denial, and down to the lowest levels of skepticism. And it seems to make no difference if there is physical evidence, as long as complete denial is in play. The cover-ups seem to abound, from area 51 to areas 1000's.

Maybe it is time for a major complete research study on the host in number of the major UFO coverups. Of course area 51 probably needs to continue to be at the top of the list, as so many key players have openly talked of their experiences in the coverup. The key to compelling the release of the real story of UFO's may very well "still be hidden" in the details of the coverups, and in the memories the people directly involved.

[Pimander]

this new weapon can be very effective in knocking out an enemy's electronics, rending most high tech weaponry inoperable

http://godfatherpolitics.com/12477/military-test-microwave-weapon-successfully-knocks-electronics/

They would also make most cars and planes inoperable and modern digital cameras.  High powered microwaves also have profound effects on consciousness and well known effects like not being frozen to the spot or losing your memory become not so mysterious.




It is an observation I have made in the past too rdunk.  Some of the witnesses are credible enough if they testified to send someone the the electric chair but if they say they have had a UFO encounter then people laugh.

The so called cover up is so complex though.  It is not just a cover up of ETs visiting Earth that is causing the confusion unfortunately.  It is just not that simple.  Partly the confusion derives from several phenomena being treated like one thing.  Just because two things can be seen in the sky that are difficult to explain that does not mean the two things are the same class of phenomenon.    I will try to explain more of what I have found in future threads.

[ArMaP]

The other day when I was meant to get some time on line, my modem/router was damaged.  I feel like some cosmic force is against me recently!