How far is too far for free speech?

[Pimander]

p.s.  it was pimander who gave me the link, btw, so you can't accuse me of dredging it up from some fanatical evangelical website. hehe

There is some interesting material in that book.  It is easy to underestimate the power of the church, even within Rosicrucian groups.  They have eyes everywhere and a hand in many things.

ETA: Zorgon has read that book I think.

[petrus4]

I wear a Crown... (as do several others in the Medieval recreation groups)

So WHY do people bow down to me and do my bidding? I have no power over them. I have no army to force them. So WHY do they choose to follow me?

The answer is simple. I have something they want... and to get that they are willing to pay the price. The price in this case is voluntary vassalage. In return they get to participate in cool events, have camp space and amenities supplied, get meals and get to have a lot of fun without having the responsibility.

What you are essentially doing here, is exploiting a condition of developmental immaturity in other people; and the fact that you call them sheep, implies to me that you are doing so consciously.

As I've mentioned before, I have had experience with successful leadership myself; and it can be addictive for both ruler and ruled, I know.  The difference between you and myself, however, (as I have also said before) is that I recognise that whether or not leadership is a necessary evil, it is still an evil.

As Martin Luther King indirectly observed, the long trend of history points away from monarchy; and this is not, as Mencius Moldbug claimed, mere Whiggish interpretation, but empirically observable fact.  Monarchy is as vestigial as the appendix was formerly believed to be, and potentially equally harmful.  The entire reason why the state of slavery which exists today, is almost totally psychological rather than externally legal, is because of the degree to which humanity has historically demanded its' freedom.  While I will admit that I am as distressed as anyone else, that the march of Liberty has apparently almost completely stalled at the current time, I can hope that we are merely experiencing a temporary roadblock, owing to the sophistication of contemporary governmental techniques.

The foreign, Satanic reptiles and their laws have incrementally been pushed back, and back, until at last they are currently making their final, desperate stand; and if in said stand they are defeated, then they will have had their chance, and they will be forced to accept exile from this planet for ever. 



I greatly look forward to the day when this happens; its' anticipation is one of the primary reasons for my existence at the current time.

[The Matrix Traveller]

The 'human Primate' doesn't want to face WHAT really 'Controls', nor do they want to know WHY ?

But in no way does this change anything, or the outcome.   

When we realise the 'human Primate' is part of the 'Story' being experienced, then we learn
to know LIFE, and what the reason for all we experience, (most are totally unaware of,
or simply don't want to know) is totally different than what we all previously imagined. 

All our reasoning (Involving 'Double Logic' present in the human genome   ) and belief
has absolutely no affect whatsoever on what is taking place or WHY.

Even IF one can convince every one in this Program (Earth) of anything, this still does NOT change
what is going on or WHY !.

We each experience our own 'Story' but the outcome is still the same.

What we believe will happen won't happen, and what we think will never happen, shall happen.   

It is NOT what happens to the Earth that profits anything but rather something entirely different !

[zorgon]

What you are essentially doing here, is exploiting a condition of developmental immaturity in other people;

You mean like they would rather do the vassalage than the physical work to make it happen?  How is it exploitation if it is by mutual agreement?

and the fact that you call them sheep, implies to me that you are doing so consciously.

No I call them educated followers. The sheep are those that follow blindly

The difference between you and myself, however, (as I have also said before) is that I recognise that whether or not leadership is a necessary evil, it is still an evil.

Well when anarchy takes over after the SHTF... who do you thing will rule the roost?  Yeah most likely evil gang overlords will step up first... and the sheep will follow because they will need a protector  and the whole thing will start all over again

That whole thing about the meek inheriting the Earth... NOT gonna happen   

As Martin Luther King indirectly observed, the long trend of history points away from monarchy;

Hmmm wasn't he assassinated?     Also interesting to note he took the name of a Rosicrucian 

[Norval]

That whole thing about the meek inheriting the Earth... NOT gonna happen   

Yes they do.

and the BRAVE and stout of heart inherit the heavens. 

[Wrabbit2000]

I saw this in my daily trawl of the news sites and immediately thought of this thread. It's not uncommon these days to find people who look at the problems across America and allow themselves to imagine it at a level far far worse than the reality of daily life here actually is.

This is what it looks like in a nation that gives no lip service to free speech. Here is a nation that has no institutional respect for it, or laws to protect it at the State level.

KUWAIT CITY (AP) — The Kuwaiti Cabinet stripped citizenship from 33 people this year, including at least three who were vocal critics of the government, Human Rights Watch said Sunday.

The New York-based rights group said Kuwait announced the latest batch of 18 people who were stripped of their nationality on Sep. 29. It called on Kuwaiti authorities to stop the practice against those exercising free speech and to ensure that people who lose their citizenship have the right to an independent review of the ruling.

"Instead of targeting their critics in a back-door way, the Kuwaiti authorities should come clean and stop revoking their citizenships once and for all," Nadim Houry, deputy Middle East director at Human Rights Watch, said in a statement.

The group said "revocation decisions are not subject to any judicial or administrative appeals process," but that courts did examine five citizenship revocations since 2010 of people born to Kuwaiti fathers.

Source

Harsh penalty for unpopular opinions. I wonder what happens to them if they don't happen to have dual citizenship somewhere else? Join the Bedouin tribes perhaps?

Anyway, it never hurts to see a control example for perspective. I can't voice feelings of wanting to physically harm our top leaders....and that really is how it needs to be. Someone can't threaten to kill ME without criminal penalty either. Its simply a different charge and handled with far less urgency.  I CAN call the President a fool, a tool and the dumbest thing to walk the earth since Howdy Doody. Nothing bad will happen to me and I need not fear anything as a result of my political opinions.

Call the Monarch of Thailand a silly old fool with no sense, and you'll be spending time in a Thai prison. No kidding. Call the Kuwaiti Royals a bunch of crooked fools and you lose your nation and right to have a home at all. Ahh.. Perspective. It is important to check occasionally, eh?

[petrus4]

That whole thing about the meek inheriting the Earth... NOT gonna happen   

The meek tend to have limits, Zorgon; Jesus lost his temper once.  The other main source of danger for the psychopaths, is the fact that they are a very, very small minority.  That is the entire reason why they want to do the Georgia Guidestones purge, in the first place.  They need to radically reduce the non-psychopath to psychopath ratio, if they want to stay in power.

All the psychopaths really have, is their ability to brainwash the police and military as effectively as they have, in order to keep propping them up.  Let them lose that, and let the majority know that they've lost it...even for a brief period...and watch what will happen.

[Wrabbit2000]

The other main source of danger for the psychopaths, is the fact that they are a very, very small minority. 

I hate to say it....but research and studies have proven that the line between normalcy and psychopathy is a very thin one that most of us are capable and fully willing to cross. We'll say we won't. We'll tell ourselves 'I'd NEVER do........(whatever it is)' but the research says otherwise. Put in a position where sociopathic or psychopathic behavior is not only witnessed but expected or allowed as the norm? It seems we really do have a good and bad side. Carl Yung may have been right after all. Duality seems a norm for man.

Welcome to the Stanford Prison Experiment web site, which features an extensive slide show and information about this classic psychology experiment, including parallels with the abuse of prisoners at Abu Ghraib. What happens when you put good people in an evil place? Does humanity win over evil, or does evil triumph? These are some of the questions we posed in this dramatic simulation of prison life conducted in the summer of 1971 at Stanford University.

Source: Stanford Prison Experiment (it's well worth reading the whole thing. It's a fascinating study of human nature)

I imagine they would have loved to run that experiment out for the full 14 day period they planned. However, the situation between Guard and Inmate for the simulation produced such horrible conditions by the 6th day, they had to shut the whole thing down before someone got killed. This was strictly a sim run in the basement of one of the buildings on Campus and using converted rooms off a hallway. As generic as it comes, and as general for result as they could make it. The normal college kids assigned as inmates became truly victimized and were showing signs of psychological trauma after that short period. The students assigned as guards became abusive, violent and sadistic, again, in that short a period.

In fact, in reading what they have for detail? In less than 36 hours, the prisoners had effectively lost their identity as students in an experiment, as the guards had lost their sense of the same. They had both begun, if not fully taken on their roles of serious adversaries with goals of either breaking or asserting control with whatever it took to achieve. They note that by this time, the guards literally DID see the student prisoners as honestly out to get them, and a true threat to them within the context of the experiment or not. That included a student who they learned by censored mail, had joined the experiment to expose it, having totally misunderstood what it was for. Even he was fully drawn in and engaged to the point of personal pride for fictitious achievements within the fiction of the scenario.

This is how I believe we see good men and women join the Police force or Military (among positions of authority in society) and, sometimes, turn bad. Sometimes...turn VERY bad, and in less time than we might want to believe it could happen.

The psychopaths are not a comfy "them". They are very much "us". Every last one of us...if put in the situation for it to flourish, and without foundation to resist and fight it on sight, IMO. Foundations are weak in the modern age.

[Sinny]

Source: Stanford Prison Experiment (it's well worth reading the whole thing. It's a fascinating study of human nature)

I've always enjoyed this experiment, I would like to see it repeated, whilst changing some variables..

[zorgon]

The meek tend to have limits, Zorgon; Jesus lost his temper once.

I would not classify Jesus as 'meek'

The other main source of danger for the psychopaths, is the fact that they are a very, very small minority. 

NOT true... but Wrabbit said it better than I was going to.  ALL of us have the psychopath within us. It merely needs the right trigger to release it

There are other experiments  using electric shock buzzers... we should post those results here too. The caveman within us is not that deeply buried

That is the entire reason why they want to do the Georgia Guidestones purge, in the first place.  They need to radically reduce the non-psychopath to psychopath ratio, if they want to stay in power.

This supposed 'purge' is something only conspiracy nuts talk about. IF they really wanted to eliminate 80% of the population they would have done so already  It is so easy to do  we have literallt thousands of ways to wipe out mass groups of people in an instant.  Just look at what Saddam did to the Kurds with the gas Reagan sold him



The 'psycopaths' NEED the numbers of people... because based on the Laws of Attraction... the more minds you have to control, the stronger your power. Its like a computer  One that has 30 megabytes capacity can do very little whereas one that has several terabytes capacity is a powerful machine

Back in the good old days the rulers that knew this TRUTH were few and the Secret was well guarded... so you only had a few (relatively speaking) despots

But today the Secret is out and any wannabe Cult Leader can use it to gain power.

The secret is in the numbers. You cannot control that which you destroy. They do not want to wipe out the numbers... they want to control them

If you want to take over a country... would not having a huge army of mindless sheep that you can convince to run up a beach into certain death be a useful tool?

It worked at Normandy

Let them lose that, and let the majority know that they've lost it...even for a brief period...and watch what will happen.

The Majority would be totally lost and helpless without their controllers

The ONLY solution to all our problems is to replace the bad leaders with good leaders...  the sheep will always be the sheep.

[The Matrix Traveller]

Re. my comments on/about the OP

Interesting thing; When sworn in (By Western governments and others)  they lay their hand on a bible !



And in the same bible it is written ..... QUOTE;

"Though Shalt NOT swear by anything."



The 2nd point is; Many human churches, would have you believe that the WORD of God is the bible.

This is WHY thy put their hand on the bible when sworn in or to give evidence in court procedures.   



Now it is Written in this same bible, QUOTE:

'In the Beginning was the WORD and the WORD was GOD !'

Which is actually Correct BUT;


NOTE:

It is NOT written:

In the Beginning was The WORD and The WORD was bible !



IF that bible was the WORD of God, it would be written as such, and it plainly  isn't !

It is written, that the WORD was GOD .... and NOT bible !

Now some refer to their Lord as 'The Architecture of the Universe',

such as in 'Free Masonry' and religious groups, (human churches and others.), yet they FAIL
to recognise, the 'Geometric' form that make up the 'letters' and 'numerals', within Languages
or Communication !

To understand the WORD GOD, one has to look at the 'Architecture' of the WORD GOD,
and NOT the understanding 'of the human Species', having "Double Logic " present
in their 'Genome' and other 'species'.



There is nothing at all which is NOT 'expressed' in form, including the 'Non-Dimensional',
expressed in terms of Concepts which also involves 'Form' !

Even such things as 'Emotions' and others involve form ..... 



So the Lie being told by 'Human Species', is that the WORD of God, is the bible.

The 'Swearing In' process is a LIE, an Insult to LIFE and a Mockery of the process,
and the human species !



So as for 'Free Speech',    How far should it go ?

ALL the way !

But all is accountable and has its Consequences.


IF one exposes the TRUTH, then their lives might be short in this Program, 'Earth', as the TRUTH is NOT
in the 'human Species' or any other on the Earth, but instead from another source, which is LIFE.

But those who do expose the TRUTH know this and accept it.   

[Pimander]

The Majority would be totally lost and helpless without their controllers

Well I'm not lost - I'm always right here, right now! Never anywhere else at any other time. 

The ONLY solution to all our problems is to replace the bad leaders with good leaders...  the sheep will always be the sheep.

And the Shepherd....

The Vision of Hermes

It chanced once on a time, while I was meditating on the things that are, my thought was raised to a great height, yet my bodily senses had been put under restraint as in sleep, though not such sleep as that of men weighed down by fullness of food or bodily weariness. Methought a Being more than vast, in size beyond all bounds, called out my name and said:

"What would you hear and see, and what have you in mind to learn and know?"

"Who are you?" said I.

"I am the Pymander, Divine Mind of the Sovereignity, the Shepherd of Men. I know what you desire, and I am with you everywhere."

"I long to learn the things that are, " I replied, "and comprehend their nature, and know God. This is what I desire to hear."

"Hold in your mind all you would know," the Shepherd answered back to me, "and I will teach you."

Pimander at your service.

[The Matrix Traveller]

The Vision of Hermes:

Full of knowledge and Wisdom ...   

I love these 'writings' as they confirm what I have found myself.   

[Pimander]

"I am the Pymander, Divine Mind of the Sovereignity, the Shepherd of Men. I know what you desire, and I am with you everywhere."

That is my favourite line.  It tells me all I need to know.

[zorgon]

Tells me you misspelled your name