Sick and disabled braced for enforced work-for-benefits programme

[zorgon]

Sick and disabled braced for enforced work-for-benefits programme

UK

Welfare claimants could be forced to work without pay and be stripped of benefits under scheme starting on Monday

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2012/nov/30/sick-disabled-work-benefits-programme

[ArMaP]

Seeing that that "news" is from two years ago, did it happen or not?

[zorgon]

Dunno  we rarely ever get follow ups on news stories... usually buried on page 110 in fine print

Maybe Sinny can catch us up 

[Sinny]

I've just finished watching a 'Sanction' discussion on the Parliament channel as it happens. 

In the last two years benefit sanctions have increased ten fold, as has the use of foood banks.

The Government and DWP appear to be in cahoots to increase 'sanctions', this is because some one under sanction is classed as 'off benefit', which they use in their figures to tell use claiments are 'decreasing', whilst employment is 'increasing'.

The medical and WRAG assessments are extremely flawed, and back logged in the system. They are ineffective, which leads to many cases such as the one presented in the OP.

This is of concern to our local representatives, and national charities.
The coalitions new policies have broken the law on several occasions, have breached basic human rights, and in fact remain to breach human rights, leaving a minority of the population completely destitute.

I could write a long essay on the systems faults and flaws.
In order to get around breaking the law, 'they' are simply re-writing it.

From training the other day, I learned that they want access to your 'Universal Job Match Account', which is some new rollox 'univeral' job matching site (which has been found to be fraudulent, advertising false jobs), and with this account they'll track your 'searching activity' via cookies.

And a whole bunch of crazy shizzle.

Private corporations (of which I work for a sub-contractor), are paid millions, for doing not a lot. If someone gets a job, its one they would have got anyway (in most cases).

This to could have an essay wrote on it, suffice it to say, I'm sure you can see the picture.

Things are getting quite desperate over here.

Major class warfare.

[ArMaP]

Thanks for the explanation, Sinny.

But there's one thing I didn't understand, are people being forced into unpaid work?

[Sinny]

Thanks for the explanation, Sinny.

But there's one thing I didn't understand, are people being forced into unpaid work?

I know the DWP have the power to 'mandate' somebody into a 'work related placement', in the past I now people have been mandated for up to 6 weeks'.

The DWP, pay the travel expenses, and deem this as suitable.

I have not heard of any case since the Poundland one that went to court, I forget the details and will edit them in. I think it was due to this case, 'mandation' by DWP was brought to a halt for 3 days, whilst it was pending whether the whole mandation and sanction process was even legal. I think in the end, they just changed some legislation, and the process then continued.

As you could probably guess, this has not been a popular option with the public, and for that reason, I don't think the mandation is used very often, I've been delving into the job seekers community of late, and have not heard any word of anyone recently being forced to take part.

It is wrong on a number of levels, full time 'mandated' 'voluntry' action, effectively supplies large corporations with staff working 40 hours a week for £72, breaching working rights, whilst phasing out real employment opportunities.

Completely backwards to say the least. Not that that comes at any sort of surprise, all these welfare cuts have happened without any public backing what's so ever, following a few brief months of anti-welfare propaganda. So successful have the media been, they have even taken one of our 'benefit scroungers - who they met whilst doing a documentary on Birmingham's 'poor' - and enticed her to even state she supports benefits cuts, well, she wouldn't care any more, she's just made thousands on some 'celebrity' deals.

Both our government actions reflect the exact opposite of the actions we the people would make.... Heyho.

[astr0144]

I am out of touch with the latest on the benefits system.

But from what I recall for the average adult over 25,  if you had been out of work say over 12 months or more on Job seekers allowance and say went onto Employment support allowance..they started making claimants having to go once a week to attend some location (that used to be just your local job centre..but now is often somewhere some distance away elsewhere) where they claim to help you apply for jobs and offer help and advice....Prior to this you had to apply for about 4 jobs between signing and prove that you had done so..

If you were on the sick or unable to attend the one day a week..
after so many weeks, they insist you have to take a medical..

and now they are very strict on how they access you..and many people are being forced to get back into the system or they cut or stop ones benefits... you have to be seen to be really ill or unfit to work to receive any sickness or disability benefits..most are forced back in the system like it or not..and many who are unwell are being put in very difficult situations.. where as a few years ago they would have been given support benefits no problem.

They have now brought out this universal credit or something and what maybe restricted hours if one takes a job...I do not really know too much about it or how it works..BUT it seems very demeaning...and claimants are seeming to be put in bad situations..

Barring having to work to obtain some form of benefits..
It really has become a bad situation...and I can only see it getting worse...

I think in the not so far future, they will have claimants doing community work to obtain their benefits..or force people to work.

They systems a sham as they have so many ridiculas restrictions that do not give many people good incentive to work..

What may seem unfair is for those with morgages..and families.. they get paid their morgage and earn more than someone who is just single..and the amount depends upon ones morgage payments....when that has been paid for say a year, that mounts up to a lot of benefit...where as the single person gets paid a pittance in relation..

What really gets me, is they go on about how they are needing to make cuts and savings for this and that.. many times being things that effect the poorest in society...

YET... when it came to the 2007 to 2009 financial crash.... the Governments create trillions of dollars to boost the economy with their quantitative easing...or come up with money when wars occur....

How do they justify that I do not know !

seems they just print money when they need it...but deny it to people who need it..

[Somamech]

Although this may be well out the realm of the experience's of the news article.

14 years ago I had to work for Unemployment Benefit's. I must add that I was able bodied and actively seeking work at the time.

My experience with what was called at the time " Working for the Dole" by the opposition party was actually quite positive.     

If I recall correctly I had had a choice of three place's to do "Volunteer Work".  Two place's were at Salvation Army type store's, and One was at a Chinese Museum which preserved the Gold Rush Day's in my Hometown.  Needless to say I chose the Chinese Museum....

And to this day I still maintain that was the best Job I have ever had.  All I did on my two day's per week was learn history, have very nice meals made for me, chatted with the old folk's who were volunteers to the Museum (met a qigong teacher who found Two Mortgage Breaking Gold Nuggets in his time)  and swept up incense from the temple's and around the Dragons. 

Shortly after that I got a job in 3D printing 14 years ago with a well and truly dumbed down resume 

In my experience it was very beneficial to be taken out of the job hunting rut and do something else.  Collecting Dole is one thing, getting out and about makes such a difference to your outlook when you are a true jobseeker. 

Just my thought's where I hated the Gov in power at the time but will defend that decision they made.  Dragging people away from rut's is possitive

[zorgon]

Well here in Nevada your "dole" is called UI Unemployment insurance.  As you work a small portion is put into it from your paycheck, employers sometimes match that.  When you get laid off you can collect for 26 weeks, sometimes more depending on how long you worked without collecting.

After those weeks expire that's it... you will need at least 16 weeks of work to start it again

Having able bodied people work for the dole... why is that a problem? It's just like getting a job isn't it?  Why does anyone complain? Or is it they just don't want to work and prefer the handouts so they can sit at the pub all day?

Lots of work out there needs doing  so if da Gubment is using working taxpayers money to pay the dole... seems to me getting a little work out of them is a good thing

[zorgon]

The US has a population of 316.1 million (2013 census)

Of that only about half file income tax returns  the actual number of returns with the IRS is 136,585,712

When the economy is down and people are out of work the tax base drops. They may still file but since they make no money they pay little.  My daughter works part time about 20-24 hours a week, schooling the rest of the time...  So while she is officially counted as a tax payer as she has to file... she gets it ALL back because she is a student and the annual income is officially below the poverty level for an individual


Now how long can a state or a country maintain itself when the number of actual tax payers drop below the number getting welfare?

Fortunately for Nevada, the Casinos pay most of that for us (we have no state income tax)

So why not get some work out of those who are physically able to do it? Doesn't need to be ditch digging... lots of desk jobs in the government 

[burntheships]

seems they just print money when they need it...

And then they refer to it as "Government Debt".




@Soma, great story. Thanks for sharing.


In this neck of the woods, The Salvation Army does a great job with community effort, helping in many areas of need. They have kitchens where they serve meals daily, and food banks, they will help with clothing, uitility bills....etc. , and the people who run it are not taking an exhorbitant salary. ( Unlike some other so called
"Charities".  The money they take in goes mainly to help for the needy.

[zorgon]

YET... when it came to the 2007 to 2009 financial crash.... the Governments create trillions of dollars to boost the economy with their quantitative easing...or come up with money when wars occur....
How do they justify that I do not know !
seems they just print money when they need it...but deny it to people who need it..

Think about it a bit...

In 2009 the Federal reserve could not account for NINE TRILLION DOLLARS... that works out to about 35,000 for every man woman and child in the US. Since only half of those are tax payers that is $70,000 per tax payer.

And that is just the Fed for ONE year, not counting daily operating expenses and war spending etc etc etc

So WHERE does all this money come from? I surely don't pay 70,000 a year in taxes...

They say we are TRILLIONS of dollars in Debt...

In Debt to WHO exactly?

WHO will collect if we default?

Yet annually we give BILLIONS in loan and aid to foreign countries, then years later we forgive those debts

Student loans are high these days... but most students I have known have had most of that debt forgiven or payments made so low its almost nothing

So WHERE is all this money coming from?

[Sinny]

The problem, is quite simply the minimum wage.

Which is not met in forced labour.

As it happens, the lowest 20% of our earners rely on further government hand outs in the form of 'working tax credits' just to remain above float.

We have a working poor, that should say all that needs to be said on the matter of our work prospects.

Judge a nation on how well it looks after its most vunerable members.

The UK has been hitting the headlines, constantly loosing rank in various social aspects.

[zorgon]

Well have a look at France...  perhaps UK will soon have this same issue

[zorgon]