a martian oddbox

[rdunk]

Thanks Z!! FWIW, I have developed an understanding of ArMaP, and I actually like working with him on some of these things. I do believe there is a small "crack" in his skeptic thinking, and if I can just find that right anomaly that even he "sees", then that will be a day of days!! For sure, I openly disagree with him most of the time, but he works the details very hard, and one of these days, his details are going to be the " more-clear proof" we need!!

He definitely tries to help in much of what we do here!!

[zorgon]

Hoagland et all say "NASA is covering up fossils by grinding them down"

he presents these cartoons..



And THIS one...



So then we find from a NASA presentation...



We called this one "The Garvin Trilobyte: Here is a closeup.  Now NASA was not nice enough to provide us with the original image



ArMaP did find it for us...  and what do we see?  DANG Hoagland's cartoon is spot on

Original Humphrey's Rock



After the Rover was done drilling



Now I saw no fossil trylobyte in the original image, and Dr Garvin says it was a 'joke'  Uh huh nice going Mr Senior scientist! Way to go building public trust

So if NASA is playing games with the images then there is  NO POINT looking at NASA images

[zorgon]

I do believe there is a small "crack" in his skeptic thinking,

ArMaP is a skeptic Nota skepto/bunker troll   There IS a difference. We all need to be more skeptical and go the extra mile of proof

and if I can just find that right anomaly that even he "sees", then that will be a day of days!!

Well ask him   So far the gears on the Moon, a Martian 'coin', the 'structure' in Daedalus crater on the moon, and the plasma 'object' in the STS 80 storm footage are one I know   Also the greenish methane fog cloud on Mars that was the post where we finally agreed on color as he was able to reproduce the fog using his filters   (And that cloud led me to getting the full paper on Mars Methane from NASA's password protected file server

For sure, I openly disagree with him most of the time, but he works the details very hard, and one of these days, his details are going to be the " more-clear proof" we need!!

Exactly... but DO check out his work on the moving rocks in Tsiolkovsky region that we got LRO do do a fly over of (Jack did  RIP Jack)

[rdunk]

But see there is a problem with that

IF NASA is covering up everything and editing all the photos, then there would be no point searching for ANY anomalies other than over lay artifacts Because if they were covering stuff then they would not let you find anything

Also if that were true then SOMEWHERE must exist the unedited copies otherwise there would be no point in taking them in the first place.

So if we are using NASA public images to seek anomalies  but at the same time say that those images are tampered with... then we are on a fool's errand

Since we cannot get access to the HUNDREDS OF THOUSAND of images supposedly taken by China India ESA and Japan... I would agree there are things they do not want us to see

Also the Rovers have algorithms that are capable of hiding signs of civilizations in the photos Cornell Univ published a paper which I posted way back on ATS about that. At the time it was TREASON to have a copy of those algorithms

NASA then tosses it right in your face

Well Z, the fact is, they do not/have not covered up everything!! The devil is in the details, for them and for us. Since the Mars Orbiters began, and now through the Rovers and ongoing, hundreds of thousands if not millions of photos have been taken, with each and every photo having the possibility of being different from any other. So many factors of such which give the possibility of objects being left visible in the photos, which normally would have been tampered out - multiple cameras, differing resolutions, brightness differences, very varying distances of photos taken, very busy photos with sooooooomany rocks and other etc.etc in the details, and very likely so many government/government contractor type employees doing the photo search/tampering, that much is missed. Or, they just didn't do a good enough job with the tampering to totally hide the object(s). I worked with a lot of government/government contractor types for many years, and many of them are not really charmed by what they do!! So, I am not surprised that what we see in the photos at times reflects poorly on their efforts.

I see what I see, and know what I know about some of these anomalies. And most of what I am referring to absolutely cannot be attributed to "pixelation", nor to "cosmic streak"!! 

Also, I would say that much of what I have found would not be caught by "civilization algorithms" either!

[zorgon]

I see what I see, and know what I know about some of these anomalies. And most of what I am referring to absolutely cannot be attributed to "pixelation", nor to "cosmic streak"!!

Well I do NOT think most images are tampered with though I have proven that many are. IF they don't want us to see the good stuff, they can simply NOT post them.  I would love to go through India's Japan's and China's archives but all I can find is a few selected images (and the Japanese HD TV images look like a cheap model of the moon where they forgot to change the shadows )

Also, I would say that much of what I have found would not be caught by "civilization algorithms" either!

The following image is colorized to show the specific pieces that catch my interest... I cannot fathom how people cannot see the obvious fossils

http://www.thelivingmoon.com/43ancients/04images/Mars4/Fossils/Fossil_Field_Detailed.jpg

Using simple zoom on some of those pieces













So considering the shear number of fragments in that image that look like animal bones more than fossils, I don't understand the lack of interest in that area

[rdunk]

Yes, the colorized items do have peculiar multi-shapes that seem to reflect the point of not being 'just rocks"! I think it interesting that as much as has been revealed in the raft of Mars photos, NASA an still say, with a straight face, no proof of life on Mars, past or present, fossil or otherwise! One of these days...............!!

[ArMaP]

Nah ArMaP is just being ArMaP  He wouldn't be here if we didn't have some things that stump him (by his own admission )  He tends to be over nit picky and doesn't look at things like we do and 'fill in the blanks between the lines" like we do

I am also trying to find the HAND that he found on Mars

This one?

[ArMaP]

Thanks Z!! FWIW, I have developed an understanding of ArMaP, and I actually like working with him on some of these things.

Thanks.

I do believe there is a small "crack" in his skeptic thinking, and if I can just find that right anomaly that even he "sees", then that will be a day of days!!

I hope there aren't any cracks in my sceptic thinking, as being a sceptic doesn't stop me from "seeing" any anomaly, it just makes me doubt if it's really an anomaly or if there's another explanation for it.

For sure, I openly disagree with him most of the time, but he works the details very hard, and one of these days, his details are going to be the " more-clear proof" we need!!

That's the whole idea, if we don't "filter" the findings we end up with too many and an important find may be lost in there, while if we "filter" the findings we end up with less, but harder to explain.

He definitely tries to help in much of what we do here!!

Thanks.

[ArMaP]

Also the greenish methane fog cloud on Mars that was the post where we finally agreed on color as he was able to reproduce the fog using his filters   (And that cloud led me to getting the full paper on Mars Methane from NASA's password protected file server

But I still think that the green is a result of the photos for the three channels being taken with some time between them, so the image for the green channel didn't have the cloud in the same place and was more noticeable.

[funbox]

Yes, the colorized items do have peculiar multi-shapes that seem to reflect the point of not being 'just rocks"! I think it interesting that as much as has been revealed in the raft of Mars photos, NASA an still say, with a straight face, no proof of life on Mars, past or present, fossil or otherwise! One of these days...............!!

and to think all they needed to do was open the vault somehow



http://mars.jpl.nasa.gov/msl-raw-images/msss/01077/mcam/1077MR0047340220600136E03_DXXX.jpg

funbox

[ArMaP]

ok well do a test here is one ive taken from the thumbnails and enhanced by many methods



lets see what it turns into when we see the full-size jpgraw

http://mars.jpl.nasa.gov/msl-raw-images/msss/01082/mcam/1082MR0047611100600336I01_DXXX.jpg

funbox

Here's that part of the image from the full size image.



Full image here.

[funbox]

did you notice the arrow? my other anomaly is also an anomaly



funbox

[ArMaP]

Looks like another case of JPEG compression.

[funbox]

Looks like another case of JPEG compression.

visible at 100% , no compression here,,... A triangle? since when have you known a triangle to be created by compression ? let alone a circle next to it

if you have any other examples of compression creating such a distinct marking, feel free to post it

or keep trying

funbox

[ArMaP]

visible at 100% , no compression here,,... A triangle? since when have you known a triangle to be created by compression ? let alone a circle next to it

Look at the image when resized to 1000% without resampling.



Do you see where the JPEG "tiles" begin and end? That's why I said that the triangle looks like a result of JPEG compression.

And once you have JPEG compression it affects the image at all zoom levels, obviously.