Maybe a Religion for "You"?

[ArMaP]

For instance, the crucifixion of Jesus was foretold in Psalm 22:16-18 approximately 1,000 years before Christ was born, long before this method of execution was even practiced.

I am finishing reading "The History", by Herodotus, and he writes about a Persian general and governor of Sestos (Artaÿctes) being nailed "alive to a board with hands and feet extended" by the Athenians, and this happened in 479BC, so the method was already in use many years before.

[Sinny]

Goes off to study Akhentaten.... 

[rdunk]

I am finishing reading "The History", by Herodotus, and he writes about a Persian general and governor of Sestos (Artaÿctes) being nailed "alive to a board with hands and feet extended" by the Athenians, and this happened in 479BC, so the method was already in use many years before.

Here is one statement about the "when" of Crucifixion from Encyclopedia Britannica:

Crucifixion, an important method of capital punishment particularly among the Persians, Seleucids, Carthaginians, and Romans from about the 6th century bce to the 4th century ce. Constantine the Great, the first Christian emperor, abolished it in the Roman Empire in the early 4th century ce out of veneration for Jesus Christ, the most famous victim of crucifixion.

So, I suppose that the writer of the statement that "the Psalm scriptures noted were written before the use of crucifixions were started" could be correct, whether it was 1000 years BC or 600 years BC!!

[ArMaP]

So, I suppose that the writer of the statement that "the Psalm scriptures noted were written before the use of crucifixions were started" could be correct, whether it was 1000 years BC or 600 years BC!!

Sure he could, I'm not that old.

But we shouldn't forget that we are talking about an interpretation of what is written in the psalms.

[rdunk]

Sure he could, I'm not that old.

But we shouldn't forget that we are talking about an interpretation of what is written in the psalms.

Yes, it is an interpretation, and it does seem from what is said, that the later Jesus to come is who is being referenced in the words, almost literally, doncha think? Especially when the rest of Psalm 22 is read too........! Of course remember, the words in the Old Covenant/Testament present a "shadow" of things to come during the New Covenant/Testament. So, there is much reason for the old and new to have understandable relevance in their words.

[zorgon]

Yes, it is an interpretation, and it does seem from what is said, that the later Jesus to come is who is being referenced in the words, almost literally, doncha think?

Just as a note... Rosicrucians believe in Jesus too

Just that he is a Grand Master 

Remember when he said that to his disciples he speaks plain truth but to ALL OTHERS he speaks in riddles so hearing, they do not understand?

Says so in your Book   So if your not one of the Disciples you don't have the truth

Now I know YOU won't take a minute to read these   but..  (hey at least I read YOUR book )

Harvey Spencer Lewis F.R.C., S:::I:::I:::, 33° 66° 95°, PhD

The Secret Doctrines of Jesus
by H. Spencer Lewis (Author)

The Mystical Life of Jesus
by H. Spencer Lewis (Author)

[ArMaP]

Yes, it is an interpretation, and it does seem from what is said, that the later Jesus to come is who is being referenced in the words, almost literally, doncha think?

No, I do not.

[rdunk]

Just as a note... Rosicrucians believe in Jesus too


Now I know YOU won't take a minute to read these   but..  (hey at least I read YOUR book )

Harvey Spencer Lewis F.R.C., S:::I:::I:::, 33° 66° 95°, PhD

The Secret Doctrines of Jesus
by H. Spencer Lewis (Author)

The Mystical Life of Jesus
by H. Spencer Lewis (Author)

Of course you are right Zorgon, about my not taking the time to read the book titles you posted. I did take the time to look at a few reviews of these books, and.......thoughts expressed are a mixed bag as might be expected.  I did see that Rosicrucianism was founded by Christian Rosenkreuz in the 1500's AD, so it is one of the "late bloomers" for religious groups being birthed since the Jesus of the New Covenant of the Bible.

The way I see it, the Jesus I know didn't and does not have a "mystical life, as he simply makes it very clear in what he says, that he only does what he sees the Father (God) do. Yes, there are some things Jesus chooses not to tell us, but still that should not denote "mystical -  In John 16:12, Jesus says, "I have yet many things to say to you, but ye are not able to bear them now".

However, I am confident that Jesus later shared through his Apostles and others the "many things" (and maybe all) to which he was referring, and they included them later in their writings of the Gospels of the New Testament/NewCovenant. 

Zorgon, I assume that you are secure in what you believe to be the truth, and you have self-assurance convincing reasons for what you believe..................me 2....... except, while I still have much to learn relative to what is in the Bible, I do know my name is written in the Lamb's Book of Life, and all else is secondary to that!!   †††

One other little note on this - the written Word is great, but it is not an absolute necessity for us because,.........vs10 -11 of Hebrews 8 God says: He will "write it into our minds and on our hearts"

10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:

11 And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.

[zorgon]

Of course you are right Zorgon, about my not taking the time to read the book titles you posted.

See? Now how can you learn anything if you discount EVRYTHING else and only say "But my book is real!!!"

The Library of Alexander was burned... because certain religions feared the contents might make people THINK

In A. D. 391, riots instigated by fanatical Christians damaged the collection heavily. During the years between disastrous events, the library collection had been gradually restored. In 641, the Caliph of Baghdad exhibited the same spirit of religious fanaticism in ordering Amrou to burn the books stored there.

Early in the year A. D. 642, Alexandria surrendered to Amrou, the Islamic general leading the armies of Omar, Caliph of Baghdad. Long one of the most important cities of the ancient world and capital of Byzantine Egypt, Alexandria surrendered only after a long siege and attempts to rescue the city by the Byzantines. On the orders of Omar, Caliph of Baghdad, the entire collection of books (except for the works of Aristotle) stored at the Library of Alexandria were removed and used as fuel to heat water for the city's public baths.

Upon learning of "a great library containing all the knowledge of the world" the conquering general supposedly asked Caliph Omar for instructions. The Caliph has been quoted as saying of the Library's holdings, "they will either contradict the Koran, in which case they are heresy, or they will agree with it, so they are superfluous."

This is why Religion is so dangerous  Here you have two OPPOSING religions burning the books for the same reason, but for different beliefs

Are YOU a book burner?

I did take the time to look at a few reviews of these books, and.......thoughts expressed are a mixed bag as might be expected.

Depends on the person's belief on what the review says

I did see that Rosicrucianism was founded by Christian Rosenkreuz in the 1500's AD, so it is one of the "late bloomers" for religious groups being birthed since the Jesus of the New Covenant of the Bible.

That is partially true.  That was one of the first PUBLIC orders.  Even Wikipedia has the correct version  

The Ancient and Mystical Order Rosæ Crucis (AMORC), also calling itself the Rosicrucian Order, is a Rosicrucianist organisation based in and primarily active in the United States. AMORC claims to be the modern day manifestation of the ancient Rose-Croix Order which they claim has its origin in the Ancient Egyptian mystery schools. These supposedly ancient mysteries, they claim, were preserved through the millenia by closed secret societies until the early years of 17th Century Europe. At that point, according to their internal mythology, the time was right for the existence of this body of secret knowledge to become open, i.e. revealed, to the world, in the form of the Rosicrucian's manifestos.

Whether or not you BELIEVE that version is irrelevant but the truth of it is in every conspiracy tale of the "Illuminati" There is no doubt in any ones mind that Free Masonry developed in Ancient Egypt  They were the STONE MASONS... but the Masons only have 33 degrees of knowledge... there are 360 degrees in a full circle.  The masons use the Pyramid and Eye of Ra... its on your dollar bill   The Rosicrucian's combine the Cross with the Ankh  This cross with the Rose predates any Christian use   The cross represents man with arms stretched out, the rose is the heart (the Chakra, Chi, Life Force)



The Masons were the Builders, the RC were the Philosophers. People accuse the Masons of all sorts of secret rituals but the Masons are just a club of businessmen concerned with building (and money )

The way I see it, the Jesus I know didn't and does not have a "mystical life, as he simply makes it very clear in what he says, that he only does what he sees the Father (God) do. Yes, there are some things Jesus chooses not to tell us, but still that should not denote "mystical -  In John 16:12, Jesus says, "I have yet many things to say to you, but ye are not able to bear them now".

That is YOUR OPINION... but you do NOT know what Jesus did for 33 years what you Christians call the missing years. That is a full lifetime during the prime of his life. The Church has NO IDEA what he did in those years...   There is strong evidence in old art work that He did visit Tibet and India... that hasn't been burned by the church yet

However, I am confident that Jesus later shared through his Apostles and others the "many things" (and maybe all) to which he was referring, and they included them later in their writings of the Gospels of the New Testament/NewCovenant. 

How do you KNOW that he shared ALL?  You have no basis in fact to support that. No one does. How can anyone know what someone doesn't say?

Zorgon, I assume that you are secure in what you believe to be the truth, and you have self-assurance convincing reasons for what you believe..................me 2....... except, while I still have much to learn relative to what is in the Bible, I do know my name is written in the Lamb's Book of Life, and all else is secondary to that!!   †††

yes I KNOW...  and because I KNOW I share with people who DON'T KNOW.  However I do NOT try to convert anyone because one thing I KNOW is that we all have our own path and eventually we will all arrive at our destination, one chosen by US

So to me it doesn't matter... so long as A) it works for YOU and B) You don't burn my books and thump me with yours and C) you don't come to my door with a sales pitch

And yes your name IS on the Book of Life... the Akashic Records are real  no matter what you want to call them...  and when your body is Wyrm Food... you will get to read the current chapter and go...

[zorgon]

One other little note on this - the written Word is great, but it is not an absolute necessity for us because,.........vs10 -11 of Hebrews 8 God says: He will "write it into our minds and on our hearts"

10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:

11 And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.

Yes but... most of us are NOT in the House of ISRAEL

The other problem with religious teaching that the "Word" is absolute... is that it has no room for modern science

The Qur'an says the Earth is flat  so it has to be. Never mind that it is round, that is blasphemy

What does the Bible say about the Earth being flat? How about the Sun's Orbit?  Seems the Church interpreted as a flat earth at the center of the Universe.

We all know today that is not true, the Church apologized to Galileo 350 years later and said; "Sorry for almost burning you at the stake, you were right!"

So how can the Book be 100% Gospell when reality says otherwise?

How can FAITH be right when reality says "The Earth, she's a round!"

And when a religion teaches the Children that Dinosaurs are not real (Baptists)  you get THIS



I have a Dinosaur egg   I want to sell it    I suppose no Christian will be bidding on that

[zorgon]

[rdunk]

And just after the mouse said that, this angel bat had a nice dinner, as some bats do eat mice!!

[Sinny]

Lol sounds like God is trying to keep us from technology and science,  knowledge. Ironic,  we have raped the planet and bastardised ourselves since the fall in our pursuit of such things. 

[rdunk]

Z, to me your comments relative to Dinosaurs and Christianity are a bit funny. The lengths that a few people might go to try and prove some point can get to the side of ridiculous. I have been a Christian for 60 years, and I have never in all of that time heard any Christian teaching about dinosaurs, existing or not existing. I suppose a minimal point of dino relevance might be in dealing with the thought of "how old is this Earth, really"?

Of course there are the various many great bones laying around under the ground that have been found that must have come from somewhere. So, either the animals lived on this Earth, or........the bones were simply a part of what was the result of this world having  been spoken into existence by the Creator at the time of creation, with either proposition being possible!!

IMO, except for some wanting to know every tid-bit about the historic past of this Earth, dinos are a very moooooooot point of discussion, except for those who manufacture toys, and make movies........ then that is where dinos get very real, with lots and lots of $$$$$$$!! But other than that, to most people, Mickey Mouse, Bugs Bunny, and Obi-Wan Kenobi are probably more real than are the dinos!!

[zorgon]

Z, to me your comments relative to Dinosaurs and Christianity are a bit funny.

They are supposed to be Humor keeps us sane... But I have met several Baptists in the Renaissance guilds that will get very angry if you try to convince them Dinosaurs are real. I think Evangelists take the other direction that man and dinosaurs coexisted 5,000ish years ago (like the Flintstones )

There are several 'Creationist' websites I can point you to that have that idea

The lengths that a few people might go to try and prove some point can get to the side of ridiculous. I have been a Christian for 60 years, and I have never in all of that time heard any Christian teaching about dinosaurs, existing or not existing. I suppose a minimal point of dino relevance might be in dealing with the thought of "how old is this Earth, really"?

That is because you are focused on only your perspective and are not seeking other explanations. While someone like me listens to everyone so I can better form my opions

Yes the issue is the Age of the Earth...

Google search:

baptists vs dinosaurs

The main issue

What does the Bible Says About Dinosaurs?

Genesis 1:20-25
Intro:
Evolutionists use dinosaurs to indoctrinate children that the earth is millions of years old, the proper interpretation of Genesis, and the dating of fossils. They believe the Bible does not mention dinosaurs and call them prehistoric animals.

Young earth creationists believe the Bible does mention dinosaurs and they existed with man and were created on the 5th and 6th day of creation.

Transition: What do we know about the Bible and dinosaurs?
The Bible does not use the word "dinosaur."
The Bible uses the Hebrew word "tanniyn" tan-neen. The word "dinosaur" was used in 1841 and meant "great lizard."
It is translated different ways in our English Bible. It is called "sea monster," "serpent," and it is commonly translated "dragon."
Many believe they were some sort of giant reptiles and are mentioned nearly 35 times in the Old Testament and are found both on land and water.
Dinosaurs existed with man.
The flying and sea dinosaurs were created on the 5th day and the land dinosaurs were created on the 6th day.
Two of every kind were taken on the ark [Gen. 7:9.] Those not on the ark drowned and others went extinct because of the change in climate, loss of habitat, disease and stalked by man.
They existed friendly with man and did not fear man till after the flood [Gen. 9:2].
Nearly every ancient civilization has some sort of art depicting giant reptile creatures.
a. Rock carvings in South America depict men riding dinosaur like creatures. Marco Polo reported sightings of dinosaur like creatures.
b. They have discovered fossilized footprints of humans and dinosaurs found together in North America and West-Central Asia.
c. The first dinosaur fossil was discovered in the 1820's.
The Bible describes two dinosaurs-like creatures.
Behemoth– [Job 40:15-24]. Colossal beast
a. Some have tried to identify this as an elephant or a hippopotamus. What is missing if it is a elephant, then the large trunk and ears are not mentioned. Many believe this large animal was a dinosaur.
b. Hippo's and elephants have small tails, not like a cedar. The word tail is translated as "trunk."
Leviathan– [Job 41:1-34. Large sea creature
a. Four other O.T. texts refer to this large sea creature [Job 3:8; Ps. 74:13-14; 104:25-26; Is. 27:1].
b. Some have tried to say this is a crocodile. Crocodiles are not sea creatures. Some believe it is a killer whale or Great White Shark.

http://mytrinitybaptist.org/what-does-the-bible-says-about-dinosaurs/

Of course there are the various many great bones laying around under the ground that have been found that must have come from somewhere. So, either the animals lived on this Earth, or........the bones were simply a part of what was the result of this world having  been spoken into existence by the Creator at the time of creation, with either proposition being possible!!

Yes I have heard that one... that God just added Dino bones into the matrix.  It's a great cop out Myself I am going with "They lived on this Earth MILLIONS of years ago and because of that I cannot take your book seriously

IMO, except for some wanting to know every tid-bit about the historic past of this Earth, dinos are a very moooooooot point of discussion, except for those who manufacture toys, and make movies........ then that is where dinos get very real, with lots and lots of $$$$$$$!! But other than that, to most people, Mickey Mouse, Bugs Bunny, and Obi-Wan Kenobi are probably more real than are the dinos!!

There are thousands of entries on the net about the discussion of dinos.  The Baptists are the worst.  If Dinos are prehistoric then the Earth is older than Creation by several billion years. To say the discussion of Dinos is a moot point just shows the desperation to avoid a topic that gets to the very heart of reality.

You HAVE to deny dinosaurs to maintain your faith, because to accept dinos as being real and millions of years old would contradict your book.

So I DO understand your dilemma...   but because of Dinosaurs I can never believe your version of reality



So it is no surprise that some religions want to ignore any discussion about dinos