Why Is Hubble Taking Pictures Of Mars?

[ArMaP]

that's not what I meant , I mean the numbers/ hard data , instruments of almost non variability within their accepted variations , take temperature for example .. do you cast your eye on these solid number as you would a photograph of mount sharp, do you question the numbers? , try to correlate them with what you see in the cam pics ?

See my previous answer. I trust raw data.

And I still think it's a strange question, as you are comparing the data gathered by some kind of instrument to photo enhancements that depend on what the user chose.

[funbox]

And I still think it's a strange question, as you are comparing the data gathered by some kind of instrument to photo enhancements that depend on what the user chose.

*[brackets] electromagnetic spectrum into manageable chunks, Gamma rays get segregated, the invert filter gets pressed, polar opposites  get flipped, the shadows get illuminated..* perfectly cogent analogy ArMaP, I feel

See my previous answer. I trust raw data.

scales and frameworks on the accepted bases, which are usually bias to some theorem or other, aren't raw data, human interpretation is all that's on offer and never anything but , irrespective of all system of analysis..

or did you mean something different by 'Raw data'

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[ArMaP]

*[brackets] electromagnetic spectrum into manageable chunks, Gamma rays get segregated, the invert filter gets pressed, polar opposites  get flipped, the shadows get illuminated..*

I don't understand what you mean by that.

scales and frameworks on the accepted bases, which are usually bias to some theorem or other, aren't raw data, human interpretation is all that's on offer and never anything but , irrespective of all system of analysis..

or did you mean something different by 'Raw data'

Raw data means exactly that, raw data, in this case the data as it was gathered by the instruments. If I say that the temperature outside my window is 28ºC I'm obviously basing it on a reference system, but it's still raw data, and it can be translated into any other scale or reference system. It's not interpretation, interpretation could be something like saying "it's hot". The value on the thermometer doesn't change because of the interpretation someone can make

[funbox]

Raw data means exactly that, raw data, in this case the data as it was gathered by the instruments. If I say that the temperature outside my window is 28ºC I'm obviously basing it on a reference system, but it's still raw data,

raw data means raw data ? now that is pure fiction, raw data could only come from the universes instruction Manuel , given were just a blip in the book, I hardly feel we can say were getting raw information .. the machines, then us, filter it imagine if you will if you could see it all.. now that would be Raw

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*not feeding the other thread for sag

[ArMaP]

raw data means raw data ?

I think this one is obvious. 

now that is pure fiction, raw data could only come from the universes instruction Manuel ,

My second name is Manuel, so I must be right. 

given were just a blip in the book, I hardly feel we can say were getting raw information .. the machines, then us, filter it imagine if you will if you could see it all.. now that would be Raw

OK, let's do things slowly, one step at a time.
What is data?

[funbox]

OK, let's do things slowly, one step at a time.
What is data?

a human construct... >= data

what is raw?

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[ArMaP]

a human construct... >= data

That's where we start to disagree. To me, data is information, it's a property of something that can be measured.
The way it's measured and the way the measures are represented are based on human constructs, data itself is not.

Temperature, for example, is one of those properties, and it can be felt by other animals besides humans, so it cannot be a human construct.

[funbox]

That's where we start to disagree. To me, data is information, it's a property of something that can be measured.
The way it's measured and the way the measures are represented are based on human constructs, data itself is not.

Temperature, for example, is one of those properties, and it can be felt by other animals besides humans, so it cannot be a human construct.

shall we save the philosophical/metaphysical argument, it will only get bogged Down and convoluted .. suffice to say ive never heard an animal convert c to f or use a thermometer .. I suppose your going to be dragging the children into it next.. have you no compassion ?

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[ArMaP]

shall we save the philosophical/metaphysical argument, it will only get bogged Down and convoluted ..

You should have thought of that when you asked the question that lead to this.

suffice to say ive never heard an animal convert c to f or use a thermometer ..

Neither have I, and that's why I didn't say something like that, I said that they felt the difference, so can you please give a straight answer now? Do you think that animals feel differences in temperature? Yes or no?

I suppose your going to be dragging the children into it next..

No.

have you no compassion ?

For people trying to avoid straight answers? None.

[funbox]

Neither have I, and that's why I didn't say something like that, I said that they felt the difference, so can you please give a straight answer now? Do you think that animals feel differences in temperature? Yes or no?

indeed, just like pine combs, but like I said , these things don't walk around with vacuum sealed mecury vials , or ipod wielding apps ,neither do they have constructed languages and number systems to describe and collate, they have eyes though , or some of them , maybe some of them wonder why the tiger they've spotted is wobbling in the heat haze ... and consider the tigers thoughts , are they taking advantage of the areas where the earth is scorched and hot, using visible references of heat to their advantage?

hence I ask you again if you cast an eye on the numbers, the so called 'raw data' as you do with the mars images , and do you , like the tiger, find correlations within the environment to this data?

For people trying to avoid straight answers? None.

indeed

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[ArMaP]

indeed, just like pine combs

What are "pine combs"?

but like I said , these things don't walk around with vacuum sealed mecury vials , or ipod wielding apps ,neither do they have constructed languages and number systems to describe and collate, they have eyes though , or some of them , maybe some of them wonder why the tiger they've spotted is wobbling in the heat haze ... and consider the tigers thoughts , are they taking advantage of the areas where the earth is scorched and hot, using visible references of heat to their advantage?

What they do with it doesn't change the fact that, if they feel it, it cannot be a human construct, right?

hence I ask you again if you cast an eye on the numbers, the so called 'raw data' as you do with the mars images , and do you , like the tiger, find correlations within the environment to this data?

I don't understand what do you mean by "find correlations within the environment to this data". Could you be more specific?

[funbox]

What are "pine combs"?

pine cones , sorry

What they do with it doesn't change the fact that, if they feel it, it cannot be a human construct, right?

wrong , putting a system of measurements upon temperature  is a human construction and animal reaction to , say to much heat is to drink water , a thermometers reaction is for the mercury inside  to expand in a tube to a scale of humanly constructed numbers..

your not daft enough to believe  I think that varying degrees of movement *hot/cold* are not occurring outside of the human mind to consider them do you?

although it could be argued that all sensory perceptions are boiled down to movements of electricity within a bag of mostly water, so all data is transferred out of it's raw state via perception and consideration alone , even to consider anything at all via the senses, then the brain, is to bastardise complete external energy movements beyond any form of raw information your intending to collect

I don't understand what do you mean by "find correlations within the environment to this data". Could you be more specific?

say on a really hot day at noon , do you see any heat haze ?

I thought the tiger story was a clue too

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[ArMaP]

wrong , putting a system of measurements upon temperature  is a human construction and animal reaction to , say to much heat is to drink water , a thermometers reaction is for the mercury inside  to expand in a tube to a scale of humanly constructed numbers..

To me, those are two different things: the fact that temperature exists and has different levels and the fact that humans measure it with devices made for that purpose and use at least three different scales to represent those levels.

your not daft enough to believe  I think that varying degrees of movement *hot/cold* are not occurring outside of the human mind to consider them do you?

No, I just hate misunderstandings and like clear answers.

say on a really hot day at noon , do you see any heat haze ?

I understand it now, thanks. No, I haven't seen any correlation between the data from the photos and other data, like temperature, although I have seen what looks like seasonal changes, like areas apparently covered by ice changing size with the change of seasons, or those "slope streaks" that appear in warmer seasons.

But other people, apparently, have seen, as you can see here.

I thought the tiger story was a clue too

It wasn't because I didn't understand what you meant by that, sometimes I have a hard time understanding the way you write.

[funbox]

I understand it now, thanks. No, I haven't seen any correlation between the data from the photos and other data, like temperature, although I have seen what looks like seasonal changes, like areas apparently covered by ice changing size with the change of seasons, or those "slope streaks" that appear in warmer seasons.

But other people, apparently, have seen, as you can see here.

shame they wasn't looking around much when they discovered the methane spike, that they're not attributing to seasonal conditions but connecting  at the same time to summer sun..

The methane measurements Curiosity has taken over the last two Martian years also show a "background" level that falls mostly between 0.3 and 0.8 ppbv and possibly follows seasonal patterns. The 7 ppbv spike happened for several weeks during the first autumn, so mission scientists checked carefully for a repeat spike during the second autumn. But concentrations stayed low.

"Doing a second year told us right away that the spike was not a seasonal effect," said Christopher Webster (JPL) of the SAM team in a press release. "It's apparently an episodic event that we may or may not ever see again."

The mission continues to monitor methane levels, which appear to be even lower in autumn than in other seasons. If confirmed, the low autumn level could be a delayed reaction to summer's high ultraviolet radiation

but they don't say what high ultraviolet radiation is degrading to create a spike ..


such high clarity from nasa again

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[funbox]

It would, but from what I remember of that situation, it was a GIF made with photos that showed a specific area from more than 2 three or four different positions, and the problem with that is that with 2 images we can make a stereo image that our brains convert to a 3D scene like they are used to do in our everyday life, but with more images we need them to be very similar, with small differences in perspective, so we can see the resulting animation more as a short movie of the area than as a slideshow of photos taken from different positions.

come now ArMaP , the pictures we had weren't vastly different, the biggest problem we had,was the mildly different  focal lengths , but still quite valid for discerning interconnections of matter from separated/isolated structures and shadows .

.. I suppose it all down to the perceiver, some brains can take more info than other I guess

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