The Gold Ring

[deuem]

How is a propeller like a wheel?  If you said they all have axels, I would agree on that one. But cutting through water or air with a blades is a lot different than rolling something on a wheel.

Back to axels, If you want to go there, you got my attension, spinning forces work best for all mentioned so far. So what happens in space, do we still need spinning forces. If we look at the Sci-fi movies, they all think so. The spin puts the gravity in motion, So they say. Other than gravity and getting real dizy I can't see a reason for spinining in space for a craft. Maybe there is something there, I am willing to listen......Deuem

[thorfourwinds]

How is a propeller like a wheel?  If you said they all have axels, I would agree on that one. But cutting through water or air with a blades is a lot different than rolling something on a wheel.

Back to axels, If you want to go there, you got my attension, spinning forces work best for all mentioned so far. So what happens in space, do we still need spinning forces. If we look at the Sci-fi movies, they all think so. The spin puts the gravity in motion, So they say. Other than gravity and getting real dizy I can't see a reason for spinining in space for a craft. Maybe there is something there, I am willing to listen......Deuem

Greetings:

The spin puts the gravity in motion

Actually, we were of the impression that 'the spin' had something to do with pulsed electrogravitics (Amy, help us here, please)   

or actually 'negating' gravitational forces so as to reduce/eliminate the 'gravitational effect' on the craft and occupants.

Of course, as IRCyborg will be quick to inform you, that's old hat, as even published information was available 15 years ago.


"Retired Air Force Colonel Donald Ware has passed on to me information from a three-star general he knows who revealed to him in July that 'the new Lockheed-Martin space shuttle (Space Plane) and the B-2 (stealth bomber) both have electrogravitic systems on board' and that 'this explains why our 21 Northrop B-2s cost about a billion dollars each.'

Thus, after taking off conventionally, the B-2 can switch to antigravity mode, and, I have heard, fly around the world without refueling." - Dr. Richard Boylan, Sept. 22, 1997, Sacramento, CA

The Nuclear-Pulse-powered DAEDALUS interstellar probe.

The Daedalus was the program between Medusa and Vista.

So, where does this trail now lead?

Peace Love Light

tfw   

Liberty & Equality or Revolution

[deuem]

I think the trail leads more to a spinning vortex as in nature. A force that re-cycles over and over, like the magnetic fields. Depending on how one might look at it it could be a wheel shape. The old wheel within a wheel idea comes to mind. And for every force there is an opposite force of equal power. This, if looped might self maintain for a longer time vs a rocket motor... Deuem

[Littleenki]

I think Ezekiel got a shot at that wheel in the sky.

So did the Indians, with their Vimanas.

And the Nazis....

A galaxy is a wheel, a solar system is a wheel, and quite likely, if we could envision it as a whole..the universe would look like a wheel.

At every scalar level, are wheels and wheel-like features..down to Robomont's infinity.... Not particles.

Everything vibrates as the Esoteric says..but everything also spins perpetually in one state or another..as a part of another spinning conglomerate, or down to its infinite minutia..

Frequency and spin..hence the apparent assemblage of matter..thats why Cymatic patterns always appear circular.

Ezekiel said he saw wheels within wheels...now that is important information there..very.

Ezekiel saw the flower of life.
Le

[Fruitbat]

IR cyborg.

I agree, you can't trust videos on you tube of alternative or new technologies.
So if you are "not convinced" then you have two sensible choices don't you?
You have to either walk away and try to find something else more convincing to look at, OR you have to do some independent work and physically examine the issues.
As is obvious everywhere you look now, the practice of casual and gross dishonesty is so universal since we clever people abandoned the concept of an across the board moral framework, that there is little alternative but to put these things to the test.

Of course there is always the third choice, that of endlessly debating things on the basis of "that don't look right to me", but for myself, I quite enjoy being able to say "I've done that and it worked this way". When someone then tries to argue that it does not work that way and promote false or incomplete information (such as the oft reported "lifters lift regardless of supply polarity" fallacy) nothing beats being able to say:

I've done this, it works thus, and I have the capability to prove it.

It always amazes me how people think being an armchair pundit with a good line of rap, is somehow more rewarding than getting off your backside, spending a bit of time, money, and physical effort actually investigating the issues first hand. To be fair though, it further amazes me that people like me who do spend the afore mentioned time money and effort, and have a clear vision of how this emerging technology can be developed, and what needs to be done, spend so much time engaged in punditry, and so little actually getting on with the science once they actually have a working setup to play with.

And to answer ThorFourWinds excellent question; "Where does this lead to now?" the answer is we don't know... The appallingly misnamed (IMHO) fledgling science of electrogravitics has been so lightly explored thus far, that we don't know if it's a dead end or the route to the stars. What we do know, is that more actual physical science needs to be done by people like US.

To this end, I am going to put my money where my mouth is and offer a public service.

I will support anyone who reads this thread and wants to get started in lifter work, to complete a  basic naudin lifter setup as quickly and cheaply as possible. This support is to include assistance in locating and obtaining the required parts as cheaply and quickly as possible. I can provide skype based telephone support pretty much 24/7 if you need it with the aim of getting your personal lifter from conception to proof within 2 weeks. All you need is the "will to win", some cash, (200$ worst case scenario that I can forsee, mine cost about 75$ and three days actual intermittent work including collection of the bits I needed, but it could have cost more).

I can promise you, that a working lifter IS something special. I never tire of showing visitors my "antigravity" machine, and whilst they are marvelling (most do marvel, because most people believe that we already know everything worth knowing, and the evidence fizzing and levitating in front of them does not quite fit with that assumption) I then gently explain that this isn't actually "antigravity", it's "electro-inertial transductance", it's new, and it's eventually going to change the world and you have been amongst the first to see it.

Of course it's a pile of lies, thousands of people have built ONE BASIC design, "it doesn't even fly it's own power supply!" so it must be a dead end. It'll never work as a viable space drive some people say. On the other hand there is the irrefutable evidence provided my one Mr Thomas Edison, (who when he wasn't fighting with that cranky looking Tesla bloke, was busy making a shitload of money out of his electric light bulb with the tingsten filament) realised that just because everyone Else's attempt to make an electric light was rubbish, it didn't have to be that way for ever if someone actually did some testing.

YOU could be the new "Edison" in this emerging scientific field, simply by making your own lifter, seeing what it does, and then seeing if you can think of a way of making it do it better.

Although the Edison method requires more in the way of work, and wastes more time doing stuff that does not work than the Tesla or Townsend brown "think up a completely new concept off the top of my head and then just make a staggeringly clever thing" approach, as Edison pointed out so cogently, "I may not have yet succeeded in making an electric lamp yet, but I now know several hundred ways of NOT making one". We just need more people actually doing experiments right now, who are brave enough to try stuff, until they discover something new.

Finally for the conspiracy theorists out there, would someone please explain why whenever I try to alter the inaccurate wikipedia article about electrogravitics to fit in with the observed facts, someone always deletes my input? It seems that some knowledge needs to be regularly  refreshed on wikipedia if it is to survive, which is of course a whole different an much more boring task than actually doing science.  If anyone feels like being a true champion of truth, and fancies taking on that simple challenge of keeping wikipedia honest in their "electrogravitics" article, (It does seem to require a variation on the "armchair punditry" I was being so seemingly dismissive of early in this posting, but for once the basic human need to slug it out on the internet could actually be put to good use. theres a definite longstanding and well maintained factual inaccuracy out there, two of us have proven it by doing the practical work, now it actually needs someone who enjoys "endless and pointless arguing" to go and engage with the other people who also seemingly enjoy pointless and endless arguing to keep the small flicker of truth burning that people like myself and LE have brought in from the scientific wilderness).

Whether you enjoy punditry or scientific engineering, the real question I would ask of you is: How devoted are you to pursuing the truth in what you do?

And how much of your time, effort of money can you afford to spend on this?

FB!

[Littleenki]

Fruitbat, youre a fresh breeze of wisdom, flowing through a strict skeptical world of rigidity and disbelief.

I had pondered the lifter for too long myself, and made the effort to do it again this summer..and Im glad I did..because not only did it lift and move air..it showed me something else which noone mentions or perhaps even notices..for one.....

The coolness of the air coming through it....For two....

The extreme level of ozone released from its reaction....For three

When it operates, I get a feeling I cant describe, as if there is a sort of loss of reality, or dilation effect..it's really weird and I wonder if you sense it, too?

It extends into the entire house from my shop, and when the lifter is at perfect balance, even my wife says..hey I feel funny, like Ive stepped into a big box.

Not to sound like a nutter, but thats what really amazed me into my eventual theory about lifters..not how they lift, but what they do to their surroundings.

I think someday we will join with Luke and build that chamber, with the clock and different sensors...and then we may all agree that lifting is the least of our worries as far as lifters are concerned....


Cheers, Fruitbat!

Le

[thorfourwinds]

Greetings friend and Esteemed Member Fruitbat:

Most Excellent!   

You always manage to hide so much valuable information in your "armchair punditry"   

We'll back you up by giving you your own thread for this endeavor
and assist where ever possible with graphics, edit, format - whatever   

Maybe TEAM RABUN will build one   

AmaterasuSolar, are you up for this   


Ummmmm, a name for such an adventure ...

how about

The
Electro-Inertial
Transductance
Workshop





tfw   

[Littleenki]

Thor hits it on the head again!

Electro Inertial Transductance workshop!

I think that would definitely put the electrogravitic crowd to rest...and make the technology within seem much more new and fresh..worthy of every effort and interest.

Theres a force about this effect which it seems is right there for the taking...perhaps FB's wiki entries were delted for a sinister reason?

Fruitbat was getting too close!  Wiki doesnt deserve the level of passion and desire to affect change as Fruitbat brings to the table.

PRC is the perfect home for it..and a separate page is a great idea, Thor!

Ill be keeping an eye to the North Georgia sky, for that coronal discharge from Rabun county!

Cheers!

[thorfourwinds]

I think someday we will join with Luke and build that chamber, with the clock and different sensors...and then we may all agree that lifting is the least of our worries as far as lifters are concerned....


Cheers, Fruitbat!

Le

Greetings, Esteemed Member LeDave   

How's things in Rio Linda?   


We seem to remember this clock from a recent discussion...





Peace Love Light

tfw   

Liberty & Equality or Revolution

[Littleenki]

Things are well on the front here, Thor! Thanks for asking!

And in the hilly terrain of your hearth?

Now, thats a cool clock! I love Leedskalnin's world..it might be a bit mystical, but thats how you protect the knowledge from the evil minds!;)

Also, that clock, does resemble something else we discussed on another thread..a wheel..

7red's PMH is one link in the reconstruction of Ed's wheel...is there funding for such an endeavour? 

Someday, perhaps we can join together with you and family, along with Amy and whoever wants to, and have a PRC trip to Coral Castle..that would be delightful!

Tick tock..times a ticking!:D

Cheers!

[deuem]

I like the money where the mouth is idea. I say that a lot also.

For the lifters, a lot of people say it is a dead end of sorts but I don't agree. Hi-Tech changes every day. I am sure if and when the first lifter works on its own a new day will emerge. I am currently stuck on control surfaces with no moving parts. If I have to shift the HV then I need more than one power supply. Breaking 40K is not easy to do but 9v is easy.

Any lifter worth while has to fly on its own power and be able to make flight corrections and then hover when needed .It also has to be stable in a slight wind when not moving. I do have some new radio controlled single or double axis electronic gyros that I plan on using for a stable hover.  They are now using these in the new RC helicopters. Maybe 1/2 inch square and 1/8 thick. The wire that goes to them is the heavy part and also the plastic case. So they have to be changed and board mounted to get them lighter.

Our initial on board PS should keep that lifter posted in this thread, (the cheap triangle one) for maybe 3 hours. Now it would never get that portable PS off the ground so there needs to be a solution between weights, fly time and lifting capacity. I figure anything over 10 minutes would be a nice first step.

Since I am having trouble getting them to pick a bench PS, maybe I will go at it in reverse. Make the portable PS and see what it takes to lift it.

The second problem is programming the log rhythms in order to stabilize the flight.  I need the gyros to back talk to the CPU chip and make adjustments to the power. Remember, no moving parts. Movable landing gear would be the only exception.

Deuem

[deuem]

Another question to anyone. If you were to take a piece of paper and place it between the wires, would it still lift. What I want to know is how much help, if any does the wind help. I am thinking it does nothing except make a gentle breeze but i can't see how that would lift anything. I have read this wind would need to be 100 times faster to do anything worth while. If the paper in between stopped it then what about incasing it.    Deuem

[Amaterasu]

Only if you didnt use magnet, or transformer wire, right? I cant imagine wrapping that much wire though, it would take days of patient wrapping!

A good flyback can short out across the pins, and if it gets hit back with reverse current it could fry the internal winding..I think thats what happened to fruitbat's flyback, and one of the windings got shorted.

Yes, extreme care must be used around these things.
Rubber shoes are a plus, but a delicate touch is mandatory at all times..and also when the lifter is done being flown..make sure to short the two electrodes together..to discharge the flyback.

Le

Will wrap wire for luxuries - like organic tobacco.  Oh, and for money, too.

(I did a lot of wire wrapping for My ex, the inventor...)

[Littleenki]

Lol! Youre a good sport, Amy...maybe we could hire some out of work hip hop musicians..they seem to rap well...

Cheers!

[Amaterasu]

LOL!  Dave Y'are a kick in the pants, Y'are!