are the mibs on here?

[zorgon]

Official.  Sorry, Zorgon, but there's only one way to describe my reaction to that.

You may (and were expected to) have such a reaction.  But then I highly doubt you have the level of access I do to military sites to check for yourself.

And why are they spending TRILLIONS on laser systems to create helium fusion 'stars on earth' if the 'official' version is wrong?

Hide your head in the sand if you like with silly pictures, but active fusion and plasma research is a reality all around you. That is why this is a RESEARCH site... some of us take the time to actually follow the trails to the real ACTIVE programs.

Hell I can drive down to Palmdale/Edwards and watch it in progress with a simple phone call

Be that as it may... the POINT is that while EG May or may not be an answer in the future, IF anyone actually makes and gets into production some free energy device and survives being snuffed...

It doesn't help anyone NOW

It is in the NOW that people need help. People are losing jobs, going broke, living in fear of losing everything

So Solar Energy may not be the ultimate answer  but in the INTERIM until your futuristic dream world magically materializes with no effort spent on your part...

Solar energy can provide low to no cost abundant energy to help with the CURRENT situation.

If you turn a blind eye to that  you ARE part of the problem

[zorgon]

And EG, FE is real folks. The FE isn't going to provide the power levels of fission, think of the ambient heat in your enviroment. Its an electromagnetic heat pump.

And EG is the real power, especially for weapons. So no hear, no see, no speak on that one...

So why not? Embedded solar power for the masses?

Well I will believe EG is the Salvation when and if I can see it cutting my power bill even by 25% Until then its a pipe dream... a golden goose.... a faerie tail

Cheap and homemade solar power CAN solve the problem for millions TODAY who desperately need a break from high power bills and dependency on the utility company

I have no choice but to pay them. I cannot live here in Vegas without AC when it hits 110 outside for three months straight. We had a failure in July and needed a repair... only cost $360.oo for a new controller that got fried because of it running steadily (temps never dropped below 100 even at night) It was out for a few days and in just that short time it got to 125F in the house.

Had to put a fan and a wet towel with ice to keep my ferrets alive.

A heat wave in Chicago area a few years back killed over 500 people because they don't normally need AC so didn't have it

All well and good to push ahead for this illusive 'free energy" but I would rather put time and effort into relieving the CURRENT problem as best as possible...

And if THAT can earn money towards promoting the more esoteric research, then what is wrong with that?

[petrus4]

You may (and were expected to) have such a reaction.  But then I highly doubt you have the level of access I do to military sites to check for yourself.

I don't think I'd be expecting anything connected to the public Internet to be 100% unquestionably trustworthy, personally; but that's just me.

And why are they spending TRILLIONS on laser systems to create helium fusion 'stars on earth' if the 'official' version is wrong?

I've seen Naudin's reproductions, among others.  I'm well aware that cold fusion works.  Of course, "cold," is a relative term.  The water still boils; it just doesn't get to the point where you need a conventional containment system in order to prevent everything exploding. 

You might also be right that there are intrepid 15 year olds performing said experiments; but although I normally would not want to discourage such initiative, I would probably warn against kitchen table efforts until it was known whether they were radiant to within unsafe levels or not.  The level of voltage required is something of a concern in the hands of teenagers, as well.

The other point, of course, is that although plenty of people are producing both CFRs and slightly less exotic coiled electrolysis units, I haven't yet seen videos where anyone has used any of these devices to generate meaningful power.  There are plenty of showcase videos, where they'll build something off camera and then let it run on camera for 30 seconds or so, ("Look, Ma!  Cold fusion!") but the problem is, that is as far as it goes.  I don't know whether it's because none of them know how to build the necessary interface between a generator and their appliances, whether they don't have the imagination to think that far, or whether the skeptics are right and I'm a gullible fool for thinking that any of it works; but I do consider that element strange.

Hide your head in the sand if you like with silly pictures, but active fusion and plasma research is a reality all around you. That is why this is a RESEARCH site... some of us take the time to actually follow the trails to the real ACTIVE programs.

Solar energy can provide low to no cost abundant energy to help with the CURRENT situation.

I would not at all.  I never said that about solar.  The facepalm was, as I said, due to the idea of you mentioning, "official," web sites as being a source of reliable information.  Solar can absolutely be useful; unless you've got cloud cover.

[The Seeker]

Z, I will split the cost of your solar info with you for a copy; I'm in the same boat you are health wise, but I do have a workshop available and a full blown machine,tool and die shop within a 5 minute walk of my place that I used to work at and have access to...

with you in the desert it would help you tremendously, and I get lots of sun here in Georgia and a fair amount of wind( I do live on top of a small mountain)

so lay it out, bro, I'll give it a shot...


seeker

[zorgon]

im listening zorgon.
i want to know about assembling solar panels.

Well I will set up a forum tonight for the doers who want to physically get involved to make it happen

how cheap are the parts and are they toxic to handle?

cheap... and no not toxic. The trick is in connecting them together (relatively easy) and connecting them into the grid (your house current)  You need to make sure your power is in phase with their power and best have a qualified electrician connect it the the mains

your bill is too damn high.

yes it is and we even turned off the pool this year  (too much on the water bill and the filter pump with this heat wave)  Bill would have been even higher. Sucks to not have the pool when we need it most... but what can ya do? Water bill is through the roof now with the drought and heat

My garden didn't make it  even with shade covers... all got burned despite the extra watering

Something to ponder for all you 'off the grid grow your own food' people. It only works if you have cheap available water

i have a wood burning stove.they save alot of money.probly seventy to a hundred each month in the winter.1500sq.ft.house.

We have a fireplace and an old built in grill, but the wood stove from johns mine fits the medieval decor and the heat goes into the room. We use the AC fan to circulate it.

The fireplace and grill are wood burning but have a modern gas insert.  My three mulberry trees produce a ton of hardwood every year

the only problem with solar is batteries.i may be wrong about that though.

Why is thyat a problem? Sure batteries can store power for night use, but if you run your solar system all day, what you don't actually use runs the meter in reverse even if you have no batteries in the system.

Then you use some grid power at night  you have still saved over 50% or more during the day.

[TheJanitor]

Well I will set up a forum tonight for the doers who want to physically get involved to make it happen

And follow the directions to apply for provisional patents. Selling the patents by the PRC commons and reinvesting in more inventions, patents.

[zorgon]

I don't think I'd be expecting anything connected to the public Internet to be 100% unquestionably trustworthy, personally; but that's just me.

Well Amy's Abundance Paradigm is online And no one expects you to find it trustworthy. That is why one uses RESEARCH  You find confirmation from multiple sources. If something is BS all you will find is the same source cloned repeatedly on the web and it leads in a circle or to a dead end

However when information is genuine, it leaves a trail via citations and confirming independent reports. If you doubt all that then there is no point in you looking at anything... go have another toke

I've seen Naudin's reproductions, among others.  I'm well aware that cold fusion works.  Of course, "cold," is a relative term.  The water still boils; it just doesn't get to the point where you need a conventional containment system in order to prevent everything exploding.

HE3 Fusion is not Cold Fusion

You might also be right that there are intrepid 15 year olds performing said experiments; but although I normally would not want to discourage such initiative, I would probably warn against kitchen table efforts until it was known whether they were radiant to within unsafe levels or not.  The level of voltage required is something of a concern in the hands of teenagers, as well.

yeah well the PTB is already regulating chemistry sets so there will be no new crazy wacky experiments coming along that make the true discoveries. If you listened to that kid you would have heard him say there is NO RADIATION 

HE3 Fusion reactors can be shielded with cardboard... The energy of fusion is converted directly into electricity. See that copper coil around his hot fusion plasma? That is where the electrons go

At least that kid is a DOER, not a TALKER

The other point, of course, is that although plenty of people are producing both CFRs and slightly less exotic coiled electrolysis units, I haven't yet seen videos where anyone has used any of these devices to generate meaningful power.  There are plenty of showcase videos, where they'll build something off camera and then let it run on camera for 30 seconds or so, ("Look, Ma!  Cold fusion!") but the problem is, that is as far as it goes.  I don't know whether it's because none of them know how to build the necessary interface between a generator and their appliances, whether they don't have the imagination to think that far, or whether the skeptics are right and I'm a gullible fool for thinking that any of it works; but I do consider that element strange.

Cold Fusion is in the same boat as EG IMO No working proof.

HOT fusion however is not over unity and your right  the problem for the lay person is the interface and the ability to make one big enough and affordable enough to plug a house into.

As you say the voltages they are dealing with are high and dangerous. But no more so than any EG or Tesla work....

Solar can absolutely be useful; unless you've got cloud cover.

clouds? Here in vegas? Whats that? Maybe what two days a year?

Besides a cloudy day does not prevent modern solar cells from producing. There are special lenses for that and other lenses that focus the sunlight to produce estremely high yield.

Some system because of these lenses produce a LOT of heat and you need a simple water cooling system. Use your pool or hot water tank as a heat dump and you get free hot water

In fact just black PVC pipes on the roof with a solar pump gives you all the hot water you need. Just shower before sundown

Co what does it matter if you have less on a cloudy day anyway? Even a 50% reduction is a hell of a lot better than a futuristic pipe dream.... for the here and NOW

[zorgon]

And follow the directions to apply for provisional patents. Selling the patents by the PRC commons and reinvesting in more inventions, patents.

Not sure how patents come into play as all that material is already produced. We are not inventing new tech. just building cheap public domain solar collectors...

IF we can actually get some doers over talkers

{{{waves at the Seeker}}}

[PLAYSWITHMACHINES]

Petrus4;

I will not, however, subscribe to Judeo/Christian eschatology, and I will also, if I can, do anything possible to prevent that model from coming to fruition.  We as a species both deserve better, and are capable of better.

Absolutely.

Solar power is dragging it's feet, what with power companies being involved.
But there are an increasing number of 'DIY' solar power sites.
A small windmil is of use as well (not those ghastly propellers, i mean a vertical spiral: much more efficient, silent, cool to watch) because if the sun isn't shining, the chances are it's windy instead......

As Zorgon mentioned, what with the timeframe issue, all these methods can be used, ARE being used, but it will not suffice, especially if we're going to build millions of robots

My final analysis is still the same.
HHO, water power.
It can be used to cook, heat, and power all existing engines except diesels (which IMO should have gone on the scrap heap years ago).
Even then something can be done with diesels, like using Paul Pantone's GEET reactor...
These are just stopgap measures until we can get to grips with ZPE and so forth, and i'm repeating myself here, since this has been covered in countless threads.

I agree with Zorgon's posts, except that He3 'hot' fusion was seriously researched by the russians in the 70's with the TOKAMAK reactors, and Harwell were doing the same in the 80's.
The big problem then was 'kink instability' which they seem to have solved at CERN, i won't go into details...
So why the big gap, and suddenly the renewed interest?
I believe that both fusion and EG are real effects, and both can be used to solve the energy/transport crisis, especiallly together with the water option.
Piece of cake
The expensive part of the solar panel system is the inverter, i will post some plans on how to build one.
The expensive part of the windmill is the generator, you can use stepper motors or car starter motors to great effect here.
Using direct or lensed solar energy directly using TEG's, steam, thermocouples ,heat pumps etc.
The HHO is the one that needs to go NOW....
But since this is the 'MIB's' thread, i will take up these discussions in the I.F. if anyone's interested?

IF we can actually get some doers over talkers

Ya aint seen nuttin' yet

[thorfourwinds]

im listening zorgon.
i want to know about assembling solar panels.
how cheap are the parts and are they toxic to handle?
your bill is too damn high.
i have a wood burning stove.they save alot of money.probly seventy to a hundred each month in the winter.1500sq.ft.house.
the only problem with solar is batteries.i may be wrong about that though.

Greetings:

Way back when (1978), a few friends in the Emerald Triangle put together a small company to provide solar power to our farmer friends 'off the grid'.

http://realgoodssolar.com/about-us/

Years later, we were absorbed by GAIAM... and the rest is history.   

http://blog.realgoods.com/


"Do you want to harvest sunlight, wind or falling water to power your home?

Or sell that renewable energy back to your utility company?

Are you looking to build your dream eco-home?

Or to convert to biodiesel and minimize your fossil fuel use?

This fully-updated classic of sustainable living technology tells how and gives you access to the world's most extensive selection of hardware..."

Everyone should acquire a copy of the Sourcebook.   


Peace Love Light

tfw   

Liberty & Equality or Revolution

[andolin]

Printing Solar Panels in the Backyard


http://sciencefriday.com/topics/energy/video/09/21/2012/printing-solar-panels-in-the-backyard.html

Guess I went to bed to early last night...Printable Solar Tape.....Wow.I guess the Tech is pretty much here....I did some research 2 years ago, in New York state  the Power companies will buy back any excess power you generate with a solar energy system and local and state will give you big tax incentives if you go solar.The initial expenditure (at least with my house) was 4-6 thousand. I got two quotes before I ran into some unexpected financial issues and shelved the whole thing. The upkeep on the panels (this info has probably changed since then) was just basicaly cleaning them and repairing/replacing any weather releted damage, and maintaining the battery bank. Deep cell solar rated batteries are rotated out of use after 4-6 years and they are about 200 bucks apiece (at least in 2009). Both companies recommended 12-16 batteries for my house. I guess if you are selling excess power to the utility companies those expenditures are negligible. I still get emails from one of these companies but they are one of the ones who want to own the equipment and maintain everything for you with an option to sell the service to the new homeowner if you sell, or buy back the equipment (Solar City). The tax incentives look great but there are already issues regarding government systems taxing you for going solar...Looks like you have to hide it from the man.....
http://www.milforddailynews.com/news/x1015653002/Towns-puzzled-over-solar-panel-taxes

[robomont]

i saw a power converter that takes the dc right off the panel and converts to ac.
this way less loss of power going the twenty feet into home.
yes the converter is expensive but there are cheaper versions.a car dc to ac converter is cheaper.it would take a few to run a house though.
i dont know how to sincronise the sinewaves,for the house or electric company.
i wish we could find financing.
its alot harder to build in small bites rather than a complete home system and then make payments.also my credit sucks because i pay cash for everything and owe nobody.just limited each month on cash.

also,money has no value if nobody is willing to work.free energy just means more lazy people.if humans dont work then why have them?robots can easily replace most human work.

now if we wanted to be billionaires just invent a robot that can gut and cut up a chicken.pilgrims and tyson would love you long time.

[andolin]

i saw a power converter that takes the dc right off the panel and converts to ac.
this way less loss of power going the twenty feet into home.
yes the converter is expensive but there are cheaper versions.a car dc to ac converter is cheaper.it would take a few to run a house though.
i dont know how to sincronise the sinewaves,for the house or electric company.
i wish we could find financing.
its alot harder to build in small bites rather than a complete home system and then make payments.also my credit sucks because i pay cash for everything and owe nobody.just limited each month on cash.

also,money has no value if nobody is willing to work.free energy just means more lazy people.if humans dont work then why have them?robots can easily replace most human work.

now if we wanted to be billionaires just invent a robot that can gut and cut up a chicken.pilgrims and tyson would love you long time.

Like this one.....5000 Watt Whole house inverter. 400 clams.
http://www.theinverterstore.com/5000-watt-power-inverter.html

[Amaterasu]

Solar power is dragging it's feet, what with power companies being involved.
But there are an increasing number of 'DIY' solar power sites.
A small windmil is of use as well (not those ghastly propellers, i mean a vertical spiral: much more efficient, silent, cool to watch) because if the sun isn't shining, the chances are it's windy instead......

As Zorgon mentioned, what with the timeframe issue, all these methods can be used, ARE being used, but it will not suffice, especially if we're going to build millions of robots

My final analysis is still the same.
HHO, water power.
It can be used to cook, heat, and power all existing engines except diesels (which IMO should have gone on the scrap heap years ago).
Even then something can be done with diesels, like using Paul Pantone's GEET reactor...
These are just stopgap measures until we can get to grips with ZPE and so forth, and i'm repeating myself here, since this has been covered in countless threads.

I agree with Zorgon's posts, except that He3 'hot' fusion was seriously researched by the russians in the 70's with the TOKAMAK reactors, and Harwell were doing the same in the 80's.
The big problem then was 'kink instability' which they seem to have solved at CERN, i won't go into details...
So why the big gap, and suddenly the renewed interest?
I believe that both fusion and EG are real effects, and both can be used to solve the energy/transport crisis, especiallly together with the water option.
Piece of cake
The expensive part of the solar panel system is the inverter, i will post some plans on how to build one.
The expensive part of the windmill is the generator, you can use stepper motors or car starter motors to great effect here.
Using direct or lensed solar energy directly using TEG's, steam, thermocouples ,heat pumps etc.
The HHO is the one that needs to go NOW....
But since this is the 'MIB's' thread, i will take up these discussions in the I.F. if anyone's interested?

Ya aint seen nuttin' yet

My reason for promoting electrogravitics over other FE methods:

Flying cars and floating cities.  This will add to the space Humanity can live in, unburden the Earth to a great extent, and give us FE along with it.

[Pimander]

What if electrogravitics was a counter intelligence creation by TTBrown for American intelligence?