Connecticut shooting and gun control debate

[biggles]

I heard the shooter was the 24 year old son of one of the teachers.

Thoughts start to coaelesce in my mind about why another relative goes into meltdown and murders innocent children and teachers, and also destroys the lives of parents, sisters, brothers etc forever and a day .

So what set this guy off.  I have been waiting to read or hear anything about what triggered this.

Could it be another case of ptw causing this to bring on that gun control issue again.  It worked down here in Port Arthur, Tasmania.  After that everyone had to hand in their gun, well they presumed everyone handed in their gun.

[ArMaP]

I heard the shooter was the 24 year old son of one of the teachers.

That's what they said on Friday, but it was wrong, it was the 20 years old son of the first victim, not the 24 years old one. The school have also said that the mother never worked there.

So what set this guy off.  I have been waiting to read or hear anything about what triggered this.

There's no information about it yet. It looks like there was no suicide note or anything explaining his actions.

Could it be another case of ptw causing this to bring on that gun control issue again.  It worked down here in Port Arthur, Tasmania.  After that everyone had to hand in their gun, well they presumed everyone handed in their gun.

What's a "ptw"? 
Whenever I see statements like that I always think "why should the right to have guns be more important than the right to live?"

In this case, the guns used were (apparently) owned by killer's mother, so he had easy access to them and had training (his mother took her sons to shooting ranges often). Why did she kept (apparently) 5 guns in her home along with a son with (apparently) "development problems" is also a good question.

Here in Portugal we can have guns, but we should provide a good reason for having one (like being responsible for the transport of large amounts of money or gold, for example) and we are limited to small calibre pistols. We can also legally own shotguns (we have many hunters, although we have mostly small animals, the larger animals we have are wild boars, and not the larger ones), so some of the murders are done using them (I witnessed one on September), and although guns are the most used method (27 cases out of 87 last year, 38 out of 99 cases this year, one of which I witnessed), when someone wants to kill someone else they will do it by any means (last year we had two cases of people killed with stones and one with a shovel).

That's why I think that the "right to have guns" can still exist but limited to guns that are mostly made for self-defence, like pistols, and just for smaller calibres.

Edited to add that I forgot to say that in almost all cases the victim and the killer knew each other and that the  numbers above include people killed in hit-and-run cases.

[Sgt.Rocknroll]

the gun is just a tool, if someone wants to kill someone else,  they'll find a way...Just a sad day....

[Pimander]

the gun is just a tool, if someone wants to kill someone else,  they'll find a way...Just a sad day....

It is just a tool.  However, do you think it is a coincidence that places with high murder rates tend to have the most guns?  It is definitely a double edged sword, like so many things.

[andolin]

The press will print unverified information just to keep from loosing a "scoop"...One AP writer even commented on the lamentable state of modern journalism as exhibited in the onslaught of misinformation stemming from this horrific incident..
http://connecticut.cbslocal.com/2012/12/15/as-shooting-story-unfolds-media-struggle-with-facts/

As soon as they get the facts straight, they will editorialize until some other conspiracy evolves out of it...Just in time for the Made for TV docudrama...

[sky otter]

what makes someone go and shot others before taking their own life?
how angry are people?

headlines for just this week not counting sandy hook

Police: 2 dead after shooting at Las Vegas hotel
http://news.msn.com/us/police-2-dead-after-shooting-at-las-vegas-hotel

*

Police kill gunman who wounded 3 at Ala. hospital
http://news.msn.com/us/police-kill-gunman-who-wounded-3-at-ala-hospital

*

Ind. man with 47 guns arrested after school threat
http://news.msn.com/us/ind-man-with-47-guns-arrested-after-school-threat


*

50 shots fired outside California shopping mall, causing panic
http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/12/15/15937393-50-shots-fired-outside-california-shopping-mall-causing-panic

[Sgt.Rocknroll]

It is just a tool.  However, do you think it is a coincidence that places with high murder rates tend to have the most guns?  It is definitely a double edged sword, like so many things.

No, if there weren't any guns, then there would be more murders by knife, sword, baseball bats, poison, strangulation, bombs, cars (more btw), you name it they'd find a way....

[petrus4]

I would appreciate it if, unlike what happened to a post I made in the last 9/11 anniversary thread, this post not be silently deleted by a member of the staff, because they feel that expression of the truth is somehow disrespectful to the victims of said incident.

I have never seen a single one of these incidents, where I have not been convinced, that said incident was a false flag event, staged by the American government.

The American government is currently aware of the fact, that at least an extremely high level of potential exists, for an attempt at armed revolution against said government, at some point within the next 5-10 years.  If you do not believe that, I would suggest looking up information on the Department of Homeland Security's recent massive purchases of ammunition.  I believe that the sole purpose of the DHS, is in fact to serve as a counter-revolutionary organisation.  In other words, its' purpose is not to protect the American public from terrorism, but rather to protect the American government from the public.

Given this context, the government is attempting, on a continual and relentless basis, to manufacture public support for complete confiscation of all firearms from the civilian population, and to effectively abolish the Second Amendment of the Constitution.  These shooting incidents are staged for that purpose.  They are carried out by covert military individuals, and then a scapegoat is offered up to the public, in the place of the operative who actually committed the act.

The precise rationale for gaining support for the abolition of the Second Amendment, works according to the routine of "Problem, Reaction, Solution," described by several analysts.  It is used by governments and various other organisations, to create an illusion in which the population are led to beg for the creation of a scenario which said government, or the cabal, wanted themselves in the first place.

1.  Problem:-  A mass shooting is staged by the government.

2.  Reaction:-  Massive hysteria and predictable outcry from the public.  Calls are immediately issued to "do something," and often said calls will be instigated by people from within the government itself.  A good example in this case, would be the call for new gun control legislation issued almost immediately after this shooting, by the psychopathic current Mayor of New York City, Michael Bloomberg.

3.  Solution:-  In response to the clamour for gun confiscation and increased legislation restricting the ownership of guns by the public, the government is then perceived by the people to have legitimate justification for such, which it then of course passes.  As a result, the government gets what it wanted all along, and the public are none the wiser.  Well, most of them anyway.

[sky otter]

sadly Rock, i agree with you

Man with knife injures 22 kids at school in China
http://www.usatoday.com/news/

here are an equal number of young ones killed and no world wide coverage
go figure

[Pimander]

Calls are immediately issued to "do something," and often said calls will be instigated by people from within the government itself.  A good example in this case, would be the call for new gun control legislation issued almost immediately after this shooting, by the psychopathic current Mayor of New York City, Michael Bloomberg.

I disagree that the event was staged.  I do think that it will be used to promote a gun control agenda, whether that is a good thing or not.

[robomont]

pimander your wrong,more guns equals less violence.
petrus you are right.
theyre always looking for the second shooter and the there is always a mentally handicapped person involved.
i believe this is part of mkultra .
the right hand is fast and furious and the left hand is brainwashing the tards.
notice kickass just was released at walmart and drudge just posted the kid couldnt feel pain just like kickass.
next ,wasnt there a runin with the counselor the day before.
i bet most of the dead adults were involved in something ,especially anybody involved in counseling.
first it was drug counseling for the nation and now its going to be counseling for terrorism.dont trust psycologist.

[Pimander]

The gun is the weapon of the coward and the bully.

[ArMaP]

No, if there weren't any guns, then there would be more murders by knife, sword, baseball bats, poison, strangulation, bombs, cars (more btw), you name it they'd find a way....

The problem with guns is that they make it easier and less personal as stabbing, strangling, hit with a shovel, throw under a train, etc., etc., they just have to pull the trigger.

[Sgt.Rocknroll]

Wow, the gov' staged this? Now I question why I even read these posts. That's the most assine think I've ever heard.  Sorry people very sorry.  >:(I'm pissed

[Pimander]

The obvious comparison would be between the UK and USA as they have similar cultures, media exposure, legal systems and wealth.

In the US – population 311.5 million (1) – there were an estimated 13,756 murders in 2009 (2), a rate of about 5.0 per 100,000 (3). Of these 9,203 were carried out with a firearm.

In the UK – population 56.1 million (4) – there were an estimated 550 murders in 2011-12 (5), a rate of about 1.4 per 100,000. Of these 39 were carried out with a firearm (6).

http://fleshisgrass.wordpress.com/2012/07/24/us-and-uk-murder-rate-and-weapon-updated/

So the murder rate in the USA is more than treble that of the UK.

Now lets take a look at the number of guns per capita.

United States    88.8 per 100 residents

England and Wales    6.2 per 100 residents

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Number_of_guns_per_capita_by_country

Similar culture.  Same language.  Similar legal system and value system.