Turin Shroud 'is not a medieval forgery'

[zorgon]

If there are further questions regarding life, Jesus, aliens, stargates, dimensions, the ether or anything else which doesn't require mathematical formulas (because I have dyscalcula as one of my challenges), feel free to ask, and I shall impart to you the hidden-in-plain-sight wonders of the universe in such a way that even a child will "get" it.

Religion and Politics will always be an issue as long as there are two people left on this planet.

As far as religion goes everyone is on their own path.

So you have all the answers in that video> Sorry no time to watch right now. I see you mention Stargates too. Did you know the US military has papers on those and supports our study here with advertizing on that military stargate page?

[sky otter]

what is the point of all the fighting?..what is gained

feelings of dislike for your fellows...this is not good

religion is a topic that has two sides and that isn't going to change..

let the other guy have some room to be an individual and choose 
for themselves which side they are comfortable with
and then step back in respect and do your own thing

geeeeze...

this is how those stupid wars all start..
everyone wants respect for their views but
doesn't want to advance that choice to other folk

get over it people......

we aren't going anywhere till we can accept that the differences
are good  and great even in giving something to think about
not bad and not a threat and not to be at war over

that's why this bloody planet is in the mess it's in

GROW UP

[Sgt.Rocknroll]

I don't believe anyone is fighting. Those of us that believe a certain thing and those that do not. You state your case and let it go. I DO though' stand by what I said. There is venom and sarcastic ridicule in underlying  attitudes in some post. I would just hope and yes 'pray', that people would take a little more time in composing they're responses and realize that there are good people here that deserve that respect for their beliefs.

I'm moving on now.

Peace 
Rock

[zorgon]

this is how those stupid wars all start..
everyone wants respect for their views but
doesn't want to advance that choice to other folk

Oh it is more than that Otter...

Almost everyone that comes to a forum or posts opinions on the internet has an inherent need to be RIGHT and everyone else is WRONG.

If you don't agree you are obviously a Shill, a disinfo agent, a government stooge, a sheep... add your own here '_______________'

Those that have figured it out usually have also figured out long ago that you will never change anyone's mind no matter how much you yell, stomp, scream or drop bombs on them... and those people go on with their lives.

Sometimes a few do try to show seekers the options and that is fine... present your view, let those who find value take something away...  in that sense a website or blog is probably better than a forum LOL as forums tend to get noisy when people start thumping whatever book is their personal 'bible'

get over it people......
we aren't going anywhere till we can accept that the differences
are good  and great even in giving something to think about
not bad and not a threat and not to be at war over
that's why this bloody planet is in the mess it's in
GROW UP

Well there is no rush to grow up... as this planet, this time, this incarnation here on this rock so far away from the mainstream Universe is Kindergarten.  So it's okay to poke each other with sticks, because they need to get it out of their system before they can move on.

The trick is to NOT let the fighting children get to you.

Here is my point



So the moral of the story is... if you fell like EXPLODING, get a FERRET

[Amaterasu]

As One who believes that each of Us has a unique relationship with the divine, I surely would not state that any beliefs are WRONG - for the Person espousing them.  I can say that MY path suggests that Consciousness is "God," that We all are "God" co-creating the Now, and that all is Consciousness at some level of awareness.  I have no dogma attached.

Others may disagree, and I honor Their ideas as right for Them.

[zorgon]

You can listen to my presentation I call the "MANUAL FOR LIFE" here:

Okay so I took the time to watch this...

1) I HATE those anonymous robotic voice overs. Hard to understand what the message is supposed to be...

2) We ARE gods, each and every one of us has the power to create (or destroy), to manifest our own reality. But because we are still in kindergarten, that ability has been deliberately blocked so it cannot be used wildly.

Jesus said we could move mountains, Yoda told us the same thing...

But stop and think for a minute that if EVERYONE  here and now had the ability to actually use that force in their present state of mind, imagine the chaos there would be.

Godlike powers for the current Hu-mon is like giving a kid in kindergarten a machine gun.

THAT is why even Ingo Swann was turned back when he ventured off world. And Ingo (RIP) was one of the most powerful RVers we had on this rock (in our modern society,  not counting the true Mystics that keep to themselves)

I see no "MANUAL FOR LIFE" in that video.... and I hear the word "CONTROL" used as a mantra

So perhaps what this thread needs is a little cleansing MANTRA

[sky otter]

Sometimes a few do try to show seekers the options and that is fine... present your view, let those who find value take something away...  in that sense a website or blog is probably better than a forum LOL as forums tend to get noisy when people start thumping whatever book is their personal 'bible'

well i guess that 's my problem then...sigh

[VillageIdiot]

As One who believes that each of Us has a unique relationship with the divine, I surely would not state that any beliefs are WRONG - for the Person espousing them.  I can say that MY path suggests that Consciousness is "God," that We all are "God" co-creating the Now, and that all is Consciousness at some level of awareness.  I have no dogma attached.

Others may disagree, and I honor Their ideas as right for Them.

I have a unique relationship with the divine. I behave myself and in return he robs me of my memory.

Swell guy.

[Amaterasu]

I have a unique relationship with the divine. I behave myself and in return he robs me of my memory.

Swell guy.

There is no "guy" in MY perspective...  Note that I did not say "God."  I said "divine."  We all are divine Beings - in My perspective - and no One of "supernatural" nature robs any of Us of anything.  The flow of Our co-created universe may run to memory loss, but no one "guy" is responsible.

But if, in Your perspective there IS a "guy" doing things to You...  [smile]  I am sure You are correct - for You.

[VillageIdiot]

Amat..., you know what I mean.

[zorgon]

But if, in Your perspective there IS a "guy" doing things to You...  [smile]  I am sure You are correct - for You.

And THAT is the key point.

A fortune teller uses a crystal ball, A beginning mystic gazes into a candle flame...  in truth neither the ball nor the candle are required... but when learning they are important tools for FOCUS.  A buddhist doing meditation might contemplate his navel. A Christian might focus on a crucifix, a Muslim can meditate on that meteorite at Mecca... a monk might rub his beads as he chants to keep count... a Mason or other secret order member may use odd rituals...

It doesn't matter what you focus on... all that matters is that it works for you.  There is ONE universal truth that goes beyond any religion or personal belief. And that is this...


When we 'die' (leave this shell)  at that precise moment we will know the ultimate truth.  If we are naught but worm food, then it is a moot point, because there will be true death. But if there is life beyond the grave, at that moment you will KNOW and no matter what you believed or what others told you.. in that moment all will be revealed

Now in my opinion, just in CASE, would it not be wise to face that moment and be able to say with pride... "I have done no evil"

That way if there IS a God... you have nothing to worry about. If the Buddhist are right about Karma, then again you have nothing to worry about. If there is a devil, well you have that covered as well and can say "get ye behind me"

Those souls like Jesus, Buddha, Dalai Lama etc... have been there done that and have decided to come back to our level... not to say "I told you so" but to let you know that all you have to do is get to the point that you can honestly say... "I have done no evil"

[The Matrix Traveller]

The often heated and reheated topics of religion and politics have always been nearly as divisive as science itself, and the two are inextricably woven together into a fine, sticky mess.

So True...  Anynonmouses


Those who have been there, done that and returned, bring Only One thing in common
between them all, and that is "Knowledge".

As it is said, "The Knowledge of Truth Sets you free"....


The Common thing involved, is LIFE !

Zorgon is 100 % Correct.... We ALL find out when we "Die".


Many have experienced "Death", while others a NDE, and are Still here today, to tell their "Story".

But sadly sometimes falls on deaf ears.


Perhaps people should listen more, to the many, who have either experienced "Death",
or even a NDE in the Past.

They all have their Own "Story" to tell....


As for those who haven't experienced "Death", or even a NDE in this world, will also find out,
when their time inevitably comes...   

None of us can escape "Gaining this Knowledge"...   

[1Worldwatcher]

First of all to Sgt. "I would never ridicule anyones religion my friend." I was once self proclaimed Christian and was baptized as a Lutheran. I have come to my own conclusions for myself, and this is not to imply I am correct or incorrect, it is just what makes more sense too me as an individual not finding the answers in all those familiar sought places.

I feel everyone is truly entitled and deserves the "Good Feeling" of security and fundamentally strong constitution for life in general. If the "Jesus" or "God" theory is your bed warmer, be comfortable with that and realise it is hard to discuss such things via "Black & White", written words don't do justice for straight talk, no matter what one thinks.

I had made my original post to garner the fact that there is "NO" real way of validating the Shroud for what it exactly is. Even dating is obscure for fundamental and accurate deductions, it remains the elusive Christian proof of the Carpenter's death shroud. We will never know for sure what it is from, or who is embossed upon it's surface. Though, I do admit, by following the lineage of the shroud from it's acclimation in Essen in 150A.D. it is very profound, even mentioned an apostle had rendered the shroud to him (King of Essen) but, knowing how an apostle feels toward his teacher, especially someone as significant as the Carpenter, I highly doubt they would render it to someone that was not directly associated with in the fine construct of the follower's of Jesus during that time, and the Resurrection of his passing. It would, too me at least, be too important of an artifact to pass off to someone that wasn't directly associated with the Christian movement from the beginning days. IMHO

I believe the shroud is legitimate, and from the period of that time, but I am not convinced that the image is that of the carpenter or anyone of significance due to the common practice of this during those days.

I hope everyone understands, I am not, nor will I ever smash religious people in the face with sheer disrespect, I am not religious and proclaim myself Atheist, but I understand what it means to have that moment of self security and reliance of something greater than myself with in these acclimated feeling's involving the whole "Religion" aspect, I am no longer there, but I do respect for sure.

Too all that are religious "The Shroud can never be proved to be Jesus." That is all I was conveying. And if you are a faith er or a believer, then it shouldn't bare necessary either way. Faith is with in the self perception of belief, which I am sure you are all aware of, and doesn't pose anything with in difference of your belief systems or faiths.

1WW

[Pimander]

I have done no evil"

Perhaps just starting out with that aim is rare.... which makes it all the more commendable.

[1Worldwatcher]

Perhaps just starting out with that aim is rare.... which makes it all the more commendable.

ROTF, Maybe it is "Z" on the Shroud Pim!! Ha ha ha!! See if you can talk him into laying down on an exact piece of cloth and snap some shots!!! LOL

Don't forget, "Zorgon is quite 'MidEvil' in his ways!!" LOL 

1WW