My stance on guns

[petrus4]

The U.N.

I have long been of the opinion that the United Nations should urgently be abolished; since in and of itself it is an aspirant form of tyranny, and it is a particularly insidious one, as it relies exclusively on people's positive emotions, and a suspension of critical thinking, in order to be positively regarded.

Additionally, the very concept of "hate speech," and "hate crimes," is itself a form of arbitrary and monstrous tyranny, which Hitler no doubt would have considered delightful.

It is true, however, that it is the classification and dehumanisation aspects which are the root cause, and which are the most troubling.  I was thinking earlier tonight, that such classification and division tactics are at the root of our current inability to find a better economic system. 

Virtually every form of economic organisation that we can think of, has generally been reduced down and neatly packaged into two opposing classifications; Capitalism and Communism.  Any use of currency within non-mutually reinforcing transactions, for the most part, is considered Capitalist; any talk of mutually reinforcing, altruistic behaviour which does not involve currency, is considered Socialism or Communism.  Yet here there are false associations, for the bank bailouts of 2008 were suddenly considered Capitalist, and large scale genocide and mass murder, are considered Communist.  As I have written before, with Communism we have a scenario where the concept of equitable sharing, has been placed side by side in the public mind, with the concept of genocide on a continental level.  It is practically impossible to perform any altruistic act for another person without money changing hands, at this time, at least among Americans, without being labelled a Communist.

If we are going to find any way out of this mess, then the only way we will do so, is first and foremost to get rid of the "-isms," and to simply do what can be proven to work, without having to label everything.  At times, that may well mean measures that are currently considered "Anarcho-Capitalist," such as the use of Bitcoin as a stable form of international currency.  At other times, it will mean utilising recent developmental successes which are usually considered "Communist," which would include the co-operative or worker-run factory movement, and such examples of barter-driven communities as are described here.

So we must create, if they have to be called that, hybrids, based on detached observation of simply what does or does not work within a given context, without insisting that anything must be universal or exclusive, or the "one true way."  If Zorgon wants to live in a monarchic, hierarchical society with a gold-based currency, let him.  If some of the rest of us want to do something else, then we must be permitted to as well.

This is why the talk of "unity," is vile and toxic and evil to my ears, and why I will not hear it.  All "unity," ever really means, is people of diverse backgrounds and preferred ways of governing themselves, being forced together in one giant concentration of power, where they are then forced to adopt a single way of doing things which does not suit most of them.

The United Nations is not to be embraced or advocated; as an institution, it is to be destroyed.  There is a simple litmus test as to whether or not what world government is morally tolerable, and that is to ask what is to be done with people who refuse to be part of it.

[Pimander]

We're allowed to have guns where I will be moving to next year because it will be like a farm, so therefore your allowed.

I agree that farmers should be allowed to have guns, assuming they are "stable" people.

[Pimander]

Al Gore is a "real loser", then and now. In my opinion of course, along with many millions of others. He is a real hypocritical crook, in saying one thing and doing another -  - much like someone else we all are getting to know.

I don't think you are a real person, you are just a troll for the religious right.  Nobody could possibly just believe the complete opposite to the truth with such stunning consistency. 

Gore was the WINNER OF YOUR ELECTION.  Bush was the LOSER.  The oh so democracy loving, free -  lets remember ARMED - American people were also the losers when they allowed tyranny to win over Democracy.  Shame on you all.

What did you get?  A country run by big oil and the banks.  You got wars and an unelected President.  Yep, your guns are clearly very helpful.  Pathetic.

[sky otter]

Shame on you all.
hey pimander..stuff it

R E A L L Y
we have all heard who thinks what about guns..
can we move on now or are you all going to sit in your puddles and splash somemore

waste of time.. but what's new with that??

[thorfourwinds]

those that give up liberty for freedom or safety deserve none.

We can relate to that.

For robomont




Peace Love Light

tfw   

Liberty & Equality or Revolution

[Pimander]

we have all heard who thinks what about guns..
can we move on now or are you all going to sit in your puddles and splash somemore

Spit your dummy out as much as you like.  You may not stand up for democracy, and you may dislike my free speech/typing.  Tough.

The fact of the matter is, the nonsense about guns protecting you from tyranny is a fallacy, and the only thing you can say to counter me is "shut up".  Well no I will not.  I will respond to whatever post I like, however I see fit.  And it was a response to a post and ON TOPIC.  This is a thread that someone started on guns.

If you have no contribution to make to the debate then you don't need to post.  If you do not want to see a debate on guns then don't read the threads on it.

[zorgon]

What did you get?  A country run by big oil and the banks.  You got wars and an unelected President.  Yep, your guns are clearly very helpful.  Pathetic.

[robomont]

petrus , i like what you said in that final paragraph.

my question is ,we need to prosecute a few leaders in this country for war crimes,where do we find people willing to capture ,charge and trial the so called world leaders.
presidents and pm's mostly.
when do we release bradley manning for obeying the law.
we all talk big but the powerful go free while the weak fill our jails.

[Amaterasu]

Bradley Manning is another media construct - like Adam Lanza.

[sky otter]

pimander
i have obviously pissed you off..so be it

my response was not to shut you up about your opinion

my telling you to stuff it was in response to your saying that MY COUNTRY
should be ashamed because we don't follow your pseudo intellectual feelings about
gun ownership

i took exception to that comment and i responded and continued by saying that
we have heard you
over and over and over and over
your  redundancy has not made a dent in changing anyones mind

you can say what you want till the cows come home and you probably will
we will not agree on gun ownership and that is fine with me

but do not think that i will stand for a slam on my country by you or anyone



oh i do have a comment

and i can read anything i want so there.. psss..sticking my tongue out back at cha
hahahahahahahaah



  heh heh..now we're on the right level

[zorgon]

There ya go   You tell em

[zorgon]

What did you get?  A country run by big oil and the banks.

Yeah and we see how YOUR gun control laws work...

Crroks in YOUR utopia can RENT guns to do the crime...

London's drug gangs now rent guns for their turf wars


Criminals still have access to firearms

One particular detail stood out in the accounts of the shooting of Thusha Kamaleswaran, the five-year old girl left paralysed after being caught in the crossfire during a shoot-out between two drugs gangs in south London. It seems that the gunman, Nathaniel Grant, was using a "rented" gun. It makes the process sound as casual and routine as hiring a van. In some ways this is the most chilling aspect of this dreadful case. It is not supposed to be like this. Following the Dunblane and Hungerford massacres, Parliament enacted some of the toughest firearms legislation on the planet. The ban on handguns is so rigorous that the British shooting team has to train overseas for this summer's Olympics.

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/davidhughes/100147277/londons-drug-gangs-are-now-renting-guns-for-their-turf-wars/

The ban on handguns is so rigorous that the British shooting team has to train overseas for this summer's Olympics.

Wow now how dumb is THAT?

[zorgon]

UK Organised Crime

Guns seized

Soca says it has had some early successes with firearms – this image shows some of those already seized.

In its first year, it says one of its partnerships with Dutch agencies led to the interception of rocket-propelled grenades and automatic rifles destined for the UK.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/shared/spl/hi/pop_ups/07/uk_uk_organised_crime/html/8.stm

So in the UK the citizens and the shooting clubs can't own them, but organized crime is better armed than the coppers and can even rent them...

Well our system may not be perfect but when the Gang bangers next door start shooting I can at least shoot back

And those dang rattle snakes and other desert critters can get NASTY

[zorgon]

UK Gun crime on the rise



SPIRALLING gun crime is blighting Greater Manchester with more than 3,000 firearms incidents in the last 15 months, the MEN can reveal today.

This startling figure equates to SEVEN gun-related incidents EVERY day.

And actual shootings, not including crimes where guns were not fired, increased nine per cent in the last 12 months alone, with 120 confirmed discharges.

Officers who compiled the figures say the blight being caused by gun crime is "severe", saying children as young as ten are joining south Manchester's notorious gangs.

They say splinter groups imitating gangs from Los Angeles have formed out of Manchester's infamous Doddington and Gooch gangs, with the Old Trafford Cripz consisting of ex-Gooch gangsters and the Moss Side Bloods being made up of former Doddington gang members.

The evidence of spiralling gun and gang culture - revealed by the M.E.N. today - emerged in one of three disturbing gun cases which all concluded on Wednesday with NINE young gunmen being sent to jail.

Det Supt Darren Shenton, in charge of GMP's XCalibre task force which tackles gun and gang culture, insisted the number of gun crimes had fallen dramatically overall during the last five years despite the recent increase in shootings.

http://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/news/s/1007733_gun_crime_on_the_rise

THOSE were the first three articles that came up on google search...

Seems YOUR system is not any better than ours....

As long as we allow gangs to even EXIST we will NEVER solve this issue. Here the gangs are all known... they drive around with gang logos on their cars... WHY can we not just make a law that allows us to arrest them and send them to Afghanistan or other place where they can shoot till the cows come home?

[zorgon]

Cops in huge house gun haul

MORE than 70 loyalist paramilitary weapons and thousands of bullets have been found by police in north Belfast, it was revealed today.

The huge arms cache, linked to the Ulster Volunteer Force, was uncovered as officers searched the house of a man who is believed to have taken his own life.

More guns were also found in other searches of lock-up premises in the greater Belfast area.

Police said today that all the guns had been taken away to be examined by forensics experts.

Police have not disclosed the exact location of where the guns were found, but it is understood the house where the man died suddenly last weekend is in or near the Ballysillan area.

It is one of the biggest arms dumps ever found in Belfast and ballistic tests will be carried out on every weapon to determine if they have been used, and if so, how many shootings they have been used in.

The name of the dead man has not been disclosed, but it is understood he was well known in loyalist paramilitary circles. Police are not treating his death as suspicious, but an inquest is likely to be held later.

A statement by police in the city today said: "A substantial amount of guns and ammunition were discovered as part of an investigation into the circumstances surrounding the sudden death of a man in the north of the city at the weekend.

"During a follow up search of the man's house, more than 70 suspected guns and thousands of rounds of ammunition were discovered. All have been removed for forensic examination.

"A further small number of suspected firearms were also found in lock-up premises in the greater Belfast area."

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/1821826/.html