Clementine images

[deuem]

No negatives for those photos, Clementine was the first mission with a digital camera.

So many missions so little time, I thought John said he was handed a huge negitive for the moon shot. Besides to get a huge print then, would you not need a negative or slide made? Digital printing at least to us is rather new. Computer technology was just starting to come out. If the camera was a drum scanner it would have problems also. They take a strip at a time, not the entire photo. Re-aligning the strips is hard work and give plenty of time to blur things out. I doubt if they did them all. It would take years with many people and tons of equipment. There is most likely the good and bad sets. At 60m a pixel you can hide anything small and just nudge a few pixwls to get the rest.

And like Z said, where are all the Hi-Res photos from China. They are busy re-working them for display? They said we would get them live.  Jokes on us.

[ArMaP]

Japan sent "KAGUYA" (SELENE) they took HD video o the moon... and pictures. The video looks like a clay model and shadows don't change as it reaches the terminator...  where are the THOUSANDS of hi res pictures?

The video was more of a publicity stunt from NHK, the owner of the images.

I haven't counted the original photos, but they sure look like thousands.

[Eighthman]

1) NASA is being downright rude to Chinese space scientists, as I posted. In addition, the US and its allies are presently flying aircraft over an area that China has forbidden (today) Given both of these factors, as well as the deepening rift over the American 'abuse of its privileges' (Xinhua editorial calling on the world to de-Americanize) I wonder if any sub rosa cooperation on such photos will last.

2) I do see faint outlines of clear tapered segments in the 'photo' that are not blurry. However, I don't understand why these photographic mosaic sections are tapered at all - as well as clearly tapers or 'cones' of different sizes.  I also wonder why a completely missing section gets filled up with blur by (apparently) being recompressed (?) - otherwise it would just be empty. Perhaps that was part of online transmission?

I also find it somewhat coincidental that these blurs often appear to be in front of distinct objects.

I assume in this controversy that we are also discounting reports of deliberate airbrushing of NASA photos as claimed by individuals who claimed to work for them in the past.

3) if all these foreign craft fail to post their HD pictures, somethings wrong........

[ArMaP]

So many missions so little time, I thought John said he was handed a huge negitive for the moon shot.

I think that was a Lunar Orbiter photo, not a Clementine photo.

[ArMaP]

However, I don't understand why these photographic mosaic sections are tapered at all - as well as clearly tapers or 'cones' of different sizes.

Clementine, like all other mapping probes, was on a non-circular near polar orbit, so the photos taken over the Moon's equator are not the same size of the photos taken over the poles.

I also wonder why a completely missing section gets filled up with blur by (apparently) being recompressed (?) - otherwise it would just be empty. Perhaps that was part of online transmission?

The transmission was good, that's why the original images don't have problems like that. As for the blurring, from my understanding of how it worked, the whole mosaic was compressed as one big image, so the "holes" in the image, to the compression algorithm, were part of the image.

I assume in this controversy that we are also discounting reports of deliberate airbrushing of NASA photos as claimed by individuals who claimed to work for them in the past.

Yes, as the reports I have seen are always about someone else doing the airbrushing.

3) if all these foreign craft fail to post their HD pictures, somethings wrong........

Only the Indian and Chinese images are missing, although images from Chandrayaan-1's Moon Mineralogy Mapper are available.

[deuem]

Ok, even if NASA came right out on the 6 O'clock news and said, "YES we air brushed things out on the Moon"  We are still in the same game. Without the release of the prior un-brushed prints we only have the problems to work with. So a new method needs to be found here.

If they are stupid and saved a layered version then the original data is there but under it. But who would do that. Once the photo has been flattened and re-saved there is no other data. WYSIWUG. We are stuck with either seeing through the blur. Matching patterns going in and out of the area or making things up in our own minds.

I am not even sure 100% that when they mentioned air-brush if they ment the digital one or the real one. If you blew this photo up, touched up the print with paint then re-mastered it, that would work better for us. The original pixels are there, just under real paint. If they were digital air-brushed, the pixels are gone forever.

And any screen shot will also flatten out the photo even if the original has many layers and not flat. It is a picture of a picture then.
Deuem

[Amaterasu]

I suspect the earlier photos were airbrushed with paint - any analog image.  This may or may not have included tampering with the negative.

Once images could be converted to and initially gathered in digital, the tampering became photoshop tool airbrush, in concept if not specifically photoshop.

[Eighthman]

I've tried to re-read these pages over again and I am assuming that the full, complete mosaic images are not available - only images that have been assembled with pieces missing. In addition, not all the blurred areas are tapered (although many are). So, we are left to wonder where the pieces went? Or where they are?
Just trying to get it precise in my understanding. 

[robomont]

I think i remember seeing a show on maybe nasa .they used triangle shapes to block out stuff.if so that would explain the blur.they are using a clear plastic sheeting.they can make three cuts to cover anything.plus they have a pile of them already cut up to blur things.for faster productivity.plus its a known symbol to the ones in the know.if its a triangle then you know its not a glitch.its a spook symbol.

[deuem]

A quick blur trial.  Find the RED slug

[Sgt.Rocknroll]

These images were doctored to hide massive machines and structures. I don't care really how they did it. Image masking has been going on for a long time and it will continued to be done for whatever reasons. National security, EVERY nation does it. Some people are so gullible.
Just stating the obvious!

Hey Z, I've told you I have plenty of room.

[deuem]

Sarge, I know, I agree with you. I have found every type of blur they have. Real and made up.

My bottom line question still is.  "What do we do about it"  Occupy NASA? Area 51? Without the originals or new originals that have not been worked what does everyone do? Maybe in 1.8 million pictures they missed one? But I doubt it. Maybe the Chinese will release New ones that are real. I doubt it. it would change every country in the world. Knowing if there was something going on up there, even better if it was not ours. Would "Rocknroll" the world off its foundation. Would they want to do that? I don't think so. Every religion and every economy would halt and need to be re-invented. It would crash everything. We are so well trained now it would confuse the world to stop.

I think that if there is anything there they have had 50 years to get rid of it, place it under camo or bring it inside. The Chinese might find nothing. It is easy to fool a camera. They have done that since WW1. It is harder to fool termal or radar. Maybe we are looking at the wrong things? What is it the hardest thing to fool and look there. The military does that.. Rock, what are we missing here?

Deuem

[zorgon]

So many missions so little time, I thought John said he was handed a huge negitive for the moon shot.

A 16x20 negative made from the first transmission of signals from Lunar Orbiter of Copernicus Crater  A contact printing of that negative is available here

http://landoflegendslv.com/00shoppes/04Pegasus/Pegasus_Main.html



When NASA took these images they made a mosaic on the floor at langley that looked like THIS

Besides to get a huge print then, would you not need a negative or slide made? Digital printing at least to us is rather new. Computer technology was just starting to come out. If the camera was a drum scanner it would have problems also. They take a strip at a time, not the entire photo. Re-aligning the strips is hard work and give plenty of time to blur things out. I doubt if they did them all. It would take years with many people and tons of equipment. There is most likely the good and bad sets. At 60m a pixel you can hide anything small and just nudge a few pixwls to get the rest.

Camera system for Lunar Orbiter



Information here   

http://www.thelivingmoon.com/43ancients/02files/Moon_Images_Info.html

[zorgon]

I suspect the earlier photos were airbrushed with paint - any analog image.  This may or may not have included tampering with the negative.

You 'suspect?"  LOL  Zorgon is shaking his head wondering if anyone even reads Pegasus material





The picture above right shows the sphere after modeling work. Pretty impressive eh? Notice how background is in the dark. Remove that bloke from the picture and you could EASILY pass this photo as being taken by the Apollo command module circling the Moon.





The two pictures above show how LRC made "plaster paris" copies of the Moon craters on the placards. They are checking that the craters are exactly to scale and layout, as craters shown on the lunar photographs previously taken by high magnification telescope. (Editors Note: Lunar Orbiter Photos 1965-1967) Notice the sphere in left hand picture after modeling work. This sphere had a light inside it which was translucent on the outside, hence the appearance. The large placards with Moon craters was also backlit. Turn off all your lighting, and you end up with the picture shown below



Add a spaceship window to film through and voila...



APOLLO REALITY
http://www.thelivingmoon.com/45jack_files/02archives/Apollo_Reality.html

Once images could be converted to and initially gathered in digital, the tampering became photoshop tool airbrush, in concept if not specifically photoshop.

No they chose to make a full scale plaster of paris mockup and film it On the right is the blank moon sphere, on the left the surface fly over. Camera for that one is on a track, while the ball rotates Both are back lit to give that nice lunar glow



A little lighting effect to give that eerie Apollo color...



Then put it all on a small computer screen and let the astronauts land it  



]

[Elvis Hendrix]

Z im glad you brought all that over from the living moon. it gives us lots more to discuss. thanks.